Critique / Help Series of Swings

[rdbass]

 

[redhotcoach]

The way I taught it to Brooke is your are just trying to get the barrel behind the ball to give you a longer hitting zone.

Great cranker...I think for others.... I have found that while you don't talk to the kids with the tech talk, your kids do need to know what and why they are doing things. They will be challenged by adults...my kid has looked at a ton of hitters and we have talked a ton about them. She hits with more bat speed and power then anyone her age....draws a lot of attention...and unfortunately gets approached and challenged by some adult every time I am not there. She is confident in what she does, but strangers coaching her or challenging her is very uncomfortable. I said next time scream "THIS IS NOT MY DAD! THIS IS NOT MY DAD!".

 

[crankermo]

RHC,

You had me laughing so hard I had tears in my eyes. I totally agree that your child needs to know why they are asked to do these things. I made Brooke sit down and break down video with me when we first started, I'm not going to lie either, she hated it when we first started but now she can feel her swing and break down others without blinking an eye, a great trait for a catcher by the way. We've been to some D1 camps and they couldn't teach hitting to save their lives and Brooke knew it immediately so she didn't messed up by them.

One of the best things is when she's hitting the other people at the facility literally stop and watch her. I've had parents come over and ask me how old is she and whose her hitting coach. This past weekend we played in an indoor tourney and after the championship game one of the opposing coaches came up to Brooke after the game and told her she had the prettiest swing she's ever seen and she going to be keeping tabs on her because she's going somewhere big and is going to do big things.

 

[Steve Huff]

You method has the barrel entering the hitting zone late - behind the hands....so instead of using a static example - move the tee back in your stance and hit some balls using your method. I have and I know the results...your hands come through before the barrel and are swinging in a circle so for the RH hitter the hands are heading left as they come through....it is a slice...you are missing early bat speed that will allow the barrel to catch up with the hands earlier - getting the barrel into the hitting zone early so you can square up the ball instead of slicing it - or driving it pull foul if you are early....

And if the ball is low - your hitters end up swinging down and popping it up....your method does not produce the Kemp swing....but I am always open to new things - so if you can show me a hitter using your method or you swinging off a tee using your method....remember they have to be swinging keeping the bat at the shoulder up to where the bat is flat to the ground...hands/elbow stacked with pants stripe....hands leading...no rearward launch....late snap of the wrists....shoulders turning

Absolute BS! The swing is not different than hitting straight away. The hands are not ahead of contact. The hands are 15 degrees approx. ahead of the hands. Do you think I taught my college girls and these European kids to hit foul balls? Either you don't understand, or you never played the game. I started on a men's B team at 14 and worked my way up. Never played baseball. I started coaching at 23, 18U, and I am 62. And you think I teach players to hit foul balls? Perhaps you need a better teacher. For one thing some of the girls and some of your gifs and videos here are doing exactly what I teach!

 

[Steve Huff]

Here is a good example of how the view, or even illusion of bat paths can vary. The first two gifs may have almost identical swings, except for height changes the illusion. But adding to it is angle. From behind, and from the side, the bat paths are going to look totally different. You probably were not trying to help me out, but thanks for the gifs. Cabrera looks totally fooled. It looks like a change-up away. Even so, where is his extension before his hands roll?

 

[crankermo]

Mann & Knights here is where I would personally start if I had to start over:

Through my personal experiences in this journey I've learned that the body truly knows how to do what it needs to do no matter the circumstances. The biggest dilemna we face is getting out of the way and letting it do it's thing, of this I'm extremely confident. Since day one I've told Brooke that your body will tell you everything you need to know, good/bad, but we have to understand what it's telling us first and that comes from the repition of doing things right in the first place.

I'm just a regular dad who happens to be obsesssed with hitting, like the rest of you knotheads. I had a chance to play college baseball but I blew that due to a bad attitude, the reason I bring that up is I still swing the bat a lot and love to hit, always have. Anyway here's my recollection of Brooke and I's journey so far;


1. Work from the ground up and don't get in a rush. Master each component before moving onto the next. Video EVERYTHING and EVERY step along the way. NEVER, EVER ask your DD to do something without you doing it first and understanding it completely. If you can't feel it you can't teach it!

2. FFS told me something when we first started and it's so true, forget about the damn ball, learn and trust the mechanics, focus on the process not the result, very important!

3. Now onto the actual process of learning the swing, The stance has to be athletic and powerful. IMO the Howard Carrier teaching is the best out there. Hopefully Straightleg can post the philosophy because I have lost my notes on it.

4. Lower half, Brooke and started out learning the "MOVE" and eventually moved onto TM's SnF and the difference was immediate and drastic. The whip and power are on a different level. The sound of the bat will tell you all you need to know. The Babe Ruth drill really helped Brooke out.

5. Once we got the lower half we focused on the upper half but IMO alot of it is a no teach because if the stance and lower half are correct it will take care of the upper half. I do agree with MTS on the lower back being key. Do your own research on this because I feel everyone is different and maybe it came easy for Brooke and I don't want someone to skip over this part and it hurt them. Brooke and I didn't do much at all on this honestly. The scap loading and such I didn't necessarily agree with but that's just me.

6. Hands, I know there is some debate about this right now but I'm a huge believer in it, TURN THE BARREL. The barrel path is in every elite swing I've ever seen posted. Not going to get into all the technical and medical jargon, all I told Brooke is you want to get the barrel behind the ball without dumping or chomping, Pretty simplistic I know but it worked for her. Some great technical info on this site about it, read it and understand it.

I know this seems vague but IMO it's very important to learn some lessons along the way, good/bad. If you don't know what feels wrong how will you ever know what feels right? Learn at your DD's pace and ability and always keep an open mind. Brooke and I have taken several missteps but that makes the progress that much better, you can't go forward without ever going backwards. The best thing you can do is post videos here or other sites and try some of the feedback for yourselves, that's what we did. don't let emotion come into play because your kids swing got picked apart, that's how we all learn.

 

[Steve Huff]

Still don't get it....but you keep posting like you do...no one reaching back with the hands and arms.....no one is saying to reach back with your hands and arms....no one is knocking the catchers mask off....

Quote: Originally Posted by Steve Huff View Post
"That is exactly what I am saying. And the irony of it is, when I am disagreed with, the evidence is in their SnF drill. That drill is fine you mentioned. What you do not want is a reach back with the arms during the swing, creating that wide sweep. So that drill may at least plant a seed in their heads would be not to try and knock the catcher's mask off! I think I have a photo on my other computer that I can post with this tomorrow. She looks like she is trying to kill the catcher.

In Kemps swing, you are sort of getting a "from down under view" because of his lean. If standing up, and hitting a waist high outside pitch, his swing would reach back the same distance, but not beyond the back foot."

I never implied that you teach that! If you did, everyone would be on you. I don't disagree with everything you teach or everything you do. I don't think you have fully developed concepts, and sometimes you are reinventing the wheel, or making a case to be correct, even if it flies in the face of the mass of wisdom. But some things you do I like. If you started off with throwing your hands at the catcher, I wouldn't like anything you do or say, and neither would anyone else.

 

[knightsb]

crankermo, great advice... added that to the thread index.

 

[rdbass]

Here is a good example of how the view, or even illusion of bat paths can vary. The first two gifs may have almost identical swings, except for height changes the illusion. But adding to it is angle. From behind, and from the side, the bat paths are going to look totally different. You probably were not trying to help me out, but thanks for the gifs. Cabrera looks totally fooled. It looks like a change-up away. Even so, where is his extension before his hands roll?

Steve,
That's where you maybe "wrong"? I am trying to help you out. So is everyone else. Carry on.
Crankermo, good post and thanks for sharing your journey.

 

[RayR]

Steve, I don't think I said foul balls - I said sliced contact as opposed to squaring up balls....it is exactly what Crankermo is referring to when he talks about how the ball sounds off the bat when Brooke hits....

Cabrera is squaring up this ball because his bat was launched early and when you adjust your body knows what it needs to do....like the hands slowing down just enough so the barrel can get to the ball on time....when you promote connection you lose this ability to square up balls because you place the shoulders in control....

Absolute BS! The swing is not different than hitting straight away. The hands are not ahead of contact. The hands are 15 degrees approx. ahead of the hands. Do you think I taught my college girls and these European kids to hit foul balls? Either you don't understand, or you never played the game. I started on a men's B team at 14 and worked my way up. Never played baseball. I started coaching at 23, 18U, and I am 62. And you think I teach players to hit foul balls? Perhaps you need a better teacher. For one thing some of the girls and some of your gifs and videos here are doing exactly what I teach!