strikeouts or putting the ball in play--the mental appraoch

[batsics1]

“He is a major leaguer and that's what he does for a living.”

And just like a pro golfer who fades down the stretch, or a pro basketball player who misses critical free throws, a pitcher can succumb to the moment. “No excuses”, absolutely, but stress, emotion, and fatigue all factor into a player’s ability to maintain mechanical integrity. It is part of what makes the game interesting.

The issue of this discussion is not about intentional walks – a strategic decision. It’s about situational pitching. I was just today reminded of an article by Steve Englishbey that gets to the heart of this discussion and is a much better way of looking at it than strikeouts vs. putting the ball in play.

The article concerns process vs. outcome oriented hitting. WebBall.com - Challenge Essay #3

Process over outcome is how every pitcher and pitch caller should approach every situation and at bat. Pitching to strike everyone out is too outcome oriented. Yet, I still can’t imagine how a pitcher visualizes throwing a pitch to produce a groundball – again too outcome oriented. In this case the pitcher has to imagine throwing a pitch so the ball runs into the bat. That should be an absolutely foreign concept to a pitcher.

A pitcher should follow the process that allows them to deliver their best pitch every pitch.

A pitch caller should follow a process that puts their pitcher in the most favorable position possible on every pitch.

An at bat may start with the intent to produce a ground ball. But if the first pitch fails to produce a ground ball AND fails to produce a favorable reaction from the batter, then continuing to try to induce a ground ball on the next pitch may be the wrong call. The reason for that is the previous pitch put the batters attention right where pitch two is going. Ever seen it happen: the pitcher delivers the ball with good speed, good movement, and perfect location – a great pitch - and the batter clobbers it?

Every pitch should be called to direct the batters attention to a specific spot or away from a specific spot.

 

[jimginas]

“=
The article concerns process vs. outcome oriented hitting. WebBall.com - Challenge Essay #3


Every pitch should be called to direct the batters attention to a specific spot or away from a specific spot.

interesting article, though was somewhat hard for me to grasp first read through. (I probably STILL do not completely understand it, though have the gist.)

Issue with THIS article is it relates to a BATTER's frame of mind for hitting during this ONE at-bat, where-as a pitcher has to understand pitching to get a result may and usually takes a few pitches at times to set up a batter. **You correctly state that batter's focus has to be changed. I believe that also, and we tell our pitchers that high-in gives a batter a different view to set up a low-away/low-in pitch.

---- question if you don't mind: Would you pitch a good batter with a 1-2 count swinging away (going into 4th pitch) a ball close enough to get a strike or something off the plate to see if she chases and more importantly, change her perception of her strike zone to set up the next pitch?
( I know situation dictates this pitch call, on-deck batter, speed of any runners if on base, previous success factors against certain pitches, but is the pitcher throwing this pitch to get the strikout or based on situation?)
** I'll reread the article, as I'm sure there's enough in there to help clarify the point and I'm just missing it.

 

[CoachFP]

Batsics, I like the article. The major difference between hitting and pitching, besides the obvious is that the pitcher knows where the ball is going (if they have good control) and the batter does not. So pitching for an outcome makes a lot of sense under that premise. Trying to hit a homerun on an impossible pitch won't generally work. Situational pitching is a tried and true endeavor. I pitched a 1-0 game once where twice the opposing team had bases loaded and no one out. I induced double play balls on infield ground outs. With the odds against striking out the hitters that were up and futility of a fly ball in keeping us ahead, the ground ball was the solution and I got it both times.

 

[JC heir]

Ive been reading along for a while now thinking you all are arguing about wether to pitch a ball on the plate by 2 inches vs off the plate 2 inches & the fact is, most girls just dont have that kind of control, in fact most magor league pitchers dont have that kind of control- I have watched too many throw the ball off the plate by 18 inches in an obvious attemp to hit the corner to believe it. Call what ever pitch you want- it doesnt matter a hill of beans.

 

[CoachFP]

Ive been reading along for a while now thinking you all are arguing about wether to pitch a ball on the plate by 2 inches vs off the plate 2 inches & the fact is, most girls just dont have that kind of control, in fact most magor league pitchers dont have that kind of control- I have watched too many throw the ball off the plate by 18 inches in an obvious attemp to hit the corner to believe it. Call what ever pitch you want- it doesnt matter a hill of beans.

You know what JC, I know where you are coming. Not that I was even close to being a world class pitcher, but generally I can get the ball where I want it most of the time. I instruct girls at various levels. Generally I haven't gotten them early enough to be of great help because they are already damaged goods. I am a volunteer coach at a low level D1 school and am a student of the game. I have worked with pitchers who have gotten full rides to college that when instructed to throw a pitch at a given spot, can't do it more than 5 times out of 10. Most, 95%, can't get it there 5 times out of ten. It just blows my mind. I actually make them uncomfortable because I loosen up and tell the catcher to hold up the glove and I can hit it 8-9 times out of ten with the intended spin and movement.

The biggest reason for this is their attempt to throw 7-8 pitches, and never mastering the 2-3 needed to be competitive. They throw each pitch with a different motion, falling off one way to throw a screwball, falling the other way to throw a curve, pushing forward to throw a drop, etc. The pitching coaches out there who have no idea what they are doing are the root cause of it all.

 

[batsics1]

We have a dilemma: JC heir claims most pitchers don’t have the control to spot the ball 2 inches on or off the plate; Coach FP generally agrees. FP also says the difference between hitting and pitching is the pitcher knows where the ball is going. Based on the previous comments that should read, “The pitcher more or less knows where the ball is going”. What are the qualities of a pitch that produces a ground ball? How does a pitcher throw a pitch to run into the bat producing a ground ball if they can’t consistently hit a 4 inch wide target?

“Situational pitching is a tried and true endeavor.”

I totally agree. I have never been arguing against situational pitching, for a strike-‘em-all-out mentality, or the difference between 2 inches on or off the plate. I am advocating an adaptive approach. How does hitting the spot on the first pitch vs. missing the spot affect the situation? What if the first 2 pitches miss, but the count is 1-1, etc.

The key point for me in the Englishbey article is the concept of hyper-focus. This is absolutely a factor in pitching. “I have to throw a strike”. “I can’t throw it in the dirt”. “I hate throwing the changeup, why did she call it?” Any of a million thoughts can and do affect a pitchers mechanics at all levels to a greater or lesser degree. Trying to throw a pitch to produce a ground ball can produce this type of hyper-focus in which the pitcher unconsciously guides the ball right to the bat. OTOH, a pitcher can throw the perfect pitch and have it ripped because the situation moved the batters focus exactly to that spot.

“Would you pitch a good batter with a 1-2 count swinging away (going into 4th pitch) a ball close enough to get a strike or something off the plate to see if she chases and more importantly, change her perception of her strike zone to set up the next pitch?”

It’s not entirely about on or off the plate. It is also about speeding up or slowing down the swing. And that is affected by both the speed of the pitch and what part of the strike zone you pitch to. It’s always about determining where I think the batters attention is at this exact moment. Did the previous pitch hit its spot and do what I wanted it to do? It is unlikely, under most circumstances, that I am going back to the same location on the black with the same pitch if the pitch before was off the plate even if that is where I need to go to produce the desired ground ball.

Here’s the part that I think gets missed by many: What was the flight path of the previous pitch? Can I throw something through the same flight path that moves to a different location off the plate to get the batter to fish or at least move their attention to where I want it? Or, can I throw something away from the previous flight path and clip the black and freeze the batter? Will I do it with spin or speed? It all depends on where I think the batters attention is at and where I need it to be!

 

[CoachFP]

Batsics, all of your thinking makes sense to me. I do have one question for you, have you ever been on the mound, softball or baseball? Because a lot of your observations etc. get processed through experience on the mound. You just know after a while what to do, when to do it, after analyzing what has happened. You don't have to think through everything it becomes second nature.

“Would you pitch a good batter with a 1-2 count swinging away (going into 4th pitch) a ball close enough to get a strike or something off the plate to see if she chases and more importantly, change her perception of her strike zone to set up the next pitch?”

The answer will change with the batter, the point in the game, the score, what's working for you that day etc. You can't try to think it out on paper, too many variables.

 

[jimginas]

.................
“Would you pitch a good batter with a 1-2 count swinging away (going into 4th pitch) a ball close enough to get a strike or something off the plate to see if she chases and more importantly, change her perception of her strike zone to set up the next pitch?”

The answer will change with the batter, the point in the game, the score, what's working for you that day etc. You can't try to think it out on paper, too many variables.

CoachFP: This was my question to Batsics1. Reason I asked was I was curious if his next pitch was to get the strikeout (within 4 pitches), OR as I suggest - based on situation.

I think all of us agree that the situation dictates the pitch. Thank goodness for that.

If a batter I am comfortable with or situation dictates, we'll probably go after her, BUT GENERALLY we have a rule - 0-2 or 1-2 pitches should NOT be FAT pitches..... they should be something off the corner to either get her to chase and maybe hit a weak ball or at least change her vision of the strike zone. (Could be change, could be drop-curve, coulb be something we believe she has trouble with.) The one thing we do NOT want from this pitch is to get beat on it. Batter is ALREADY protective of teh strikezone and ready to turn on a decent pitch. She goes after a pitch off the plate - good for us, Blue gives us a call - good, she doesn't swing.... we use that pitch to set the next one.
** IF situation is right, I often use this count to work on a pitch we may still be developing. (maybe her spin isn't consistant or she doesn't have confidence, or she is just afraid to throw it (inside-Rise), whatever.....

 

[CoachFP]

Jimginas, I would say and I know you would agree that you don't want any pitch to be FAT pitches whatever the count. Great pitchers like Osterman rarely throw fat pitches regardless of the count. Working on developing pitches should be in exhibition games or in bracket ball.

 

[jimginas]

100% agree - what I am saying or trying to say is I don't want the ball close enough for a batter to hit solidly. (we believe a weak hit ball that is a hit, sometimes happens and we can live with that, but we don't want a solid hit on a 0-2 or 1-2 when we had a couple pitches to work with.

***Ive been BURNT on actually telling my catcher to help out a struglling pitcher by telling her to get fatter (more to the white then we like and have had batters drill doubles and triples off ME. My fault for wanting the pitch to be too much to the middle of the plate to avoid a walk. I've learned!