RHP foot work on the pitcher's plate

[BoardMember]

Need to be careful in instructing this, I imagine.

2 of your three examples look like a legitimate "slide" where neither foot breaks contact with the pitcher's plate.

But this last one, is a pretty obvious re-plant, in my view.

Oddly enough........There is no pitchers plate in the last one.........As a side note, I find that when there is nothing to push against in a demo or practice pitch, there is no reference point, so most pitchers take a step forward........Just an observation of my experience over the last 30 years or so........I'll never say someone is illegal until they are using a plate........

I'd agree that if you are a relatively new PC, and especially if you've never pitched, you'd better be careful about a lot of things you teach. It's never been a problem for me.........

Not to say it's not a legitimate technique, but to say that if instructing this, one needs to be wary of an illegal motion developing and correct often and early to prevent that.

This technique is not any more susceptible to a replant or lift then any other........It will take years of coaching pitching before you realize that lifts and replants are MENTAL not physical.......

In fact I find it less so because the pitcher is "aware" of the slide and "cleat hook" in contact with the plate..........

I also think that employing this technique will cause the pivot foot to angle outward more often than not?
I know that you have stated in the past that you prefer a slight outward tilt of the pivot foot, and I'm not going to disagree - if it's slight. But aside from a re-plant, I'd be watching for, and correcting a pivot foot straying too far askew from the power line, also.

How far a pivot foot turns is as individual as the body we live in.........I've been this saying since I've posted here. But again, it will take YEARS more experience as a PC before you begin to realize that power lines and pivot foot angles are as SUBJECTIVE as anything else in the motion......

I'm assuming you'd have to have a chat with this young lady?...........

 

[corlay]

I'm assuming you'd have to have a chat with this young lady?...........

I get all your points, and am not necessarily disagreeing.
Just was cautioning that a less-experienced parent or even PC should be aware of what is legal and what is not, and should not let a young pitcher engrain mechanics that she'll just have to worry about and modify later. Your point of "30yrs. experience" is well taken. I have no problem admitting that I am very "green".

Also, many on this website use the very best high-level pitchers as examples and even validation for the points they are trying to make. And certainly this is applicable - to a degree. *But* for a young 10U/12U learning the sport, I think that trying to emulate what Ricketts does, for example, isn't necessarily the best path in all cases.

My point is, pitching is like any other skill that a person must practice and develop over the course of years. The very best at the skill, have likely formulated their own "quirks" or deviations from accepted textbook fundamentals, because they've been at it so long that they have evolved their mechanics to suit themselves, individually.
(Think Jimi Hendrix on guitar. Would you instruct a beginner musician to try and play like him?)

So, using Ricketts as validation for a young pitcher turning her pivot foot, is something I would not necessarily advise. More information is needed and every case is so specific.

My own experience watching young pitchers, is that those that turn their pivot foot, do it primarily to "cheat" their body position to help them to get more open, but at the expense of a powerful drive, and honestly, accuracy - from what I've seen. Obviously, the OU pitcher has no problem with being "powerful". (Also interesting that despite her turned-foot, she remains much more "closed" than most people would instruct.)

I think it would be cool someday to compile a "model pitchers" thread of women like Ricketts, Osterman, Finch, etc. showing them pitch when they were 10U/12U. (obviously, probably not obtainable or readily available...) Would be interesting to see how much of their high-level motion was present when they were young.

 

[BoardMember]

All good points.....Especially the first paragraph about inexperienced teachers. I'm 100% on board with that statement.......

 

[halskinner]

Is her foot work this quick? If it isnt, it should be. Thought you might like to see one in real time.




L and D Footwork with legal rock back

 

[cuzmail]

Thanks for the clip of Keilani. I didn't realize she started with her leap foot in the center of the plate.

That is why I was asking. PC just made a change to DD where she does the same.

 

[BoardMember]

So, using Ricketts as validation for a young pitcher turning her pivot foot, is something I would not necessarily advise. More information is needed and every case is so specific.

Corlay, I think you've got the whole validation thing backwards.........You wouldn't use Ricketts (and so many others as a matter of fact) as validation of what should be done. You would use her as validation of what CAN be done successfully.........

In other words...........Examples like Ricketts should completely dispel any fear of a pitchers "natural tendencies" being wrong, or the notion that certain mechanics create a hindrance from progression and greatness because they don't fit "someone's mold"............

If I see a kid turn her pivot foot........No matter the degree.........And all else is right with the world.........I wouldn't think of fixing it for the sake of fixing it..........Nor would I tell a student who's natural tendency is to turn the pivot foot, not to turn it, until I can prove that it is causing issues elsewhere in the sequence..........

I've seen it too many times........Example is a kid who's throwing gas and hitting her spots and spins.........And some "wanna-be" coach points out that her "pivot foot turns too much"........

All I can say to the newer coaches out there looking to help others, is to NOT OVER COACH just so they can coach......Any long time instructor worth his salt will admit to you and the world that they are guilty of this exact thing at some point in their journey toward learning to be a top level PC.........Myself included.........

Part of my success (and many others) as a PC stems from the fact that I've learned how to identify what REALLY matters........And what doesn't really matter in the whole picture.......

 

[BoardMember]

The pivot foot is an anchor. Still need a translator for those that read in regular English.

What you need is to re-take 3rd grade English.........And try for a passing grade this time around.........

 

[cuzmail]

You would use her as validation of what CAN be done successfully.........
.

Good point. I always ask the following:

Is she successful because of _______ (insert habit in question here) or is she successful in spite of it?

 

[Rick Pauly]

"To slide or not to slide"....that is the question. Well not really but thought it sounded cool. Once when doing a pitching clinic with Ernie Parker he gave the best explaination of where the pivot foot should be. His preference was that it was near the center of the body so that the pitcher can push in a balanced fashion. Now you can start with it near centered or you can do a centering slide...doesn't matter.
Many pitchers keep the push foot under the shoulder/armpit and thus tend to push only half the body......when watching pitchers perform that way you will note how uncomfortable they look. Now does that mean you can't perform well if your foot doesn't get near the center of the body? No, cause you can get real good doing things less than optimally if you work real hard.

 

[Ken B]

Rick,
Can you think of any video examples showing the two styles? When I first read what you said about centering, it didn't click. I just tried a few both ways and aside from losing my balance a couple times, I think I like it.

Thanks,
Ken