Drive Mechanics

[javasource]

I finally made my way through the entire Drive Mechanics thread today. I'm sure I will be going back to it many many times. It is packed with so much great information.

Thank you. That means a lot.

Can you please give a bit more detail on what exactly you suggest for helping with this?

To make suggestions outside of the absolutely incredible I/R progressions that BM posted would be counter-productive, IMO.

What I might suggest... is that you really look at the success she is having with drills like 'Lock-it-in' and 9:00. IMO, many blast pass these... and their quest for 'finding the whip' always takes them back to these two progressions...

Take a closer look at this stud...

If you can take your eyes off his rock-solid stature... start at the ground. Look at his feet. They put him in an 'open' stance. The front foot might be a little more to the target... but it's not pointed SO MUCH to the target... that it causes his rear hip to close (wanted to say 'fly-open'... cause that makes more sense...). I'd say that foot is in the 45-60 degree neighborhood.

Watch his hips. Are they really rotating into release? No... that ball travels in front of both... not around one.

Watch his shoulders. Are they rotating much prior to release? No. 80% of his shoulder rotation happens after the ball is out of the hand.

Now... let us take a look from 9 o'clock:

Hips/Shoulders rotating much?

Then Liberty:

Hips/Shoulders?

You get the point, hopefully.

In my experience, young pitchers really associate torso turn with pitching... ESPECIALLY those that are H/E converters... because that allows them to get their hand behind the ball early.

So... watch those again... but this time... watch his arm/hand/ball position as he comes into release of the ball. Palm to sky... pinky leads... releases off the back hip. He can feel the whip BECAUSE his body allows him to attain those articulations in his arm.

If your body rotates too closed, those articulations/positions are not possible. When I work with older beginners (14+)... they all have that light bulb moment... where they can feel the stretch and the resultant whip of the ball... but only when their body allows those things to happen... meaning they stay open... and throw across the body. You can't feel the whip with a rotating release phase... because it removes the possibility of anything other than the hand behind the ball early. Does that make sense?

Lastly, I'm not a fan of the 'hand to oppo shoulder' finish. Notice BM's follow-through. Just like he does (in these examples)... I like the wrist-laser to target, low follow-through... and my pitchers always learn control quicker... when a consistent and LOW finish TO THE TARGET is a focus. I feel better whip this way... my students do, too... and this consistent release has them spinning like champs. The other huge benefit?

They learn brush... without being taught it.... BECAUSE - a low finish is much easier with brush resistance. If they aren't maintaining some type of brush... getting that arm to decelerate (and finish low) makes the task really difficult. It's a pretty handy residual benefit...

We have been fortunate enough to have help from Ken B. and he is a wonderful help to us in this transition.

Yeah... he's a pretty cool cat.

 

[lhowser]

I want to occasionally see the foot lift off the pitching plate to initiate their "toe-in-n-go." Of course, lifting the foot is illegal, but I want them pushing the envelope. Why? Because it gets a more explosive drive out of them.

Not good in some circumstances. Yesterday in our local High School Div 1 regional semi-finals the senior pitcher on the number 2 seed was called twice with runners on 3 for illegal pitch (runner scores)because toe left the ground. It resulted in a 8-6 eight inning loss. She had never been called the entire season. She didn't replant, just occassionally barely left the ground on push off. Ump just saw it and chose to call it. Devistating for this young lady.

 

[riseball]

Ueno would be illegal in HS and college.

Just like Nevins, Carda....

 

[javasource]

Not good in some circumstances. Yesterday in our local High School Div 1 regional semi-finals the senior pitcher on the number 2 seed was called twice with runners on 3 for illegal pitch (runner scores)because toe left the ground. It resulted in a 8-6 eight inning loss. She had never been called the entire season. She didn't replant, just occassionally barely left the ground on push off. Ump just saw it and chose to call it. Devistating for this young lady.

That's truly unfortunate... especially if she or anyone else feels she was the sole reason for their loss. Whatever the cause of the IP (hers sounds like a leap, not a replant) I hope she realizes that it was also her effort and success throughout the season that helped their team reach that point.

 

[lhowser]

They learn brush... without being taught it.... BECAUSE - a low finish is much easier with brush resistance. If they aren't maintaining some type of brush... getting that arm to decelerate (and finish low) makes the task really difficult. It's a pretty handy residual benefit...

That is a really good insight. Never thought of that but I can see it. Also would help with loose vs a muscled push

 

[jryan15]

JS,

I just made it through the content thus far, and WOW, what a fantastic grouping of information. I was hoping that you might consider supplementing or possible building upon BoardMembers IR content though.

DD and I spent a lot of time on his drills (and occasionally still do). They were a very helpful instrument in teaching her how to pitch and in teaching me how to disqualify pitching instructors .

One area that I think that DD is weak is that often times her upper arm blows through the 6 o'clock position where the strong pitchers don't. BM doesn't in his drills. In all cases the upper arm stops moving for around 3 frames while the arm IR's.

In one of your posts you mentioned some exercises mentioned by Rick Pauly. I couldn't find them anywhere, so I started googling around. I came across this youtube video which he is promoting a product. I don't know anything really about the effectiveness of the product, but at around the time 8:27. He starts discussing whip and what makes contact with what.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNElSTMS-qg

I feel like more info on the actual "whip" portion of IR might help me, DD, and possibly others in the same situation.

Thanks again for all the hard work!

 

[jryan15]

Does anyone know where to buy the rubber exercise bands used in the workouts? We tied a straight band into a circle, but it doesn't work that great. I am also interested in long resistance bands as well (~6' long) for sprinting resistance training. Any insight on where to buy these would be great. Thanks!

 

[mike s]

My DD uses the Gold's Gym brand bands, got the three pack of ultra-light, light and medium. IIRC got them at K-Mart.

 

[javasource]

One area that I think that DD is weak is that often times her upper arm blows through the 6 o'clock position where the strong pitchers don't. BM doesn't in his drills. In all cases the upper arm stops moving for around 3 frames while the arm IR's.

Is this what you're asking... in regards to supplementing? Although it's in no way a supplement... I'll give you some of my thoughts on this process.

To me there are three types of whip:

1) Nowhere Near - Although it may seem a contradiction... this 'whip' does exist... in circles. This is the fictional 'get-your-hand-behind-the-ball, slam-the-door style (i.e. H/E).
2) Almost There - The arm often straightens in the back half of the circle. This adds significant energy - into the ball, through long-axis rotation of the entire arm (origination of primary axis is the shoulder... or glenohumeral). This is I/R. Picture the bicep rotating inwards, toward the body.
3) Whipper-Snapper - Real whip (IMO) is the result of Internal rotaton, AND elbow articulation, AND forearm articulation. What does that mean?

In other words, at 9:00 (meaning the BALL is at 9:00):

1. The bicep is pointed AWAY from the body (towards 2nd) - for Internal Rotation
2. The elbow has flexion (is bent). Elbow Articulation (flexion)
3. The forearm is in a supinated position, NOT neutral, and definitely not pronated. Forearm Articulation This might help (It's in Dutch, but I'm sure you can figure it out):

How is this done? Chaining backward and forward. Just like the I/R sticky says. Here's a checklist:

In Lock-it-in position:

• Is the bicep pointed to 2nd base? Try it! In this pitching position, if you are too closed with the torso... it's not. How do you fix that? OPEN.
• Is the elbow bent so that the forearm is NOT in contact with the side... but the tricep IS?
• Is the palm-up... in a supinated position? To third, is NOT up.

If you answered yes TO ALL... slowly start with hands at your side... and back-chain the movement... then toss the ball... forward chaining.

In 9:00 position:

• Is the bicep pointed to 2nd base? Try it! In this position pitching position, if you are too closed with the torso... it's not. How do you fix that? OPEN.
• Is the elbow bent? Are both the elbow and tricep off the body?
• Is the palm-up... in a supinated position? To third, is NOT up.

If you answered yes TO ALL... slowly start with hands at your side... and back-chain the movement... BUT BEFORE TOSSING THE BALL... do you back-chain into Lock-it-in properly? Did you reach Lock-it-in position going back... AND going forward? If yes... then toss the ball...

Many miss the importance of REACHING THE PREVIOUS PROGRESSION STARTING POINT in BM's progressions. From Show-It... do they reach Liberty, and 9, AND lock-it-in as they throw? If not... identify what position they are missing... and start from there. Go to where it's broken... and fix it. Sounds simple, but I know of many that are guilty of skipping the lesser motions... mainly because of impatience. Those progressions start with the whip... so do them correctly and learn to feel what a good whip is.

One thing that I find REALLY helpful... is mimicking the feel of the same release in the progressions. With students, I make this a priority. Finish low (below belly button). Finish to the target with a pronated forearm.

A few things to consider:

The arm is SO MUCH easier to control... the CLOSER it is to the body. Maintaining a consistent release will become increasingly difficult... the further 'UP' you get in the progressions (Lock, 9, Liberty, Show, 3/4). In a relatively recent conversation with Monica Abbott... she said that she consciously keeps her arm as close to her body as possible... not in an attempt to hit her side... but to brush it... keeping her arm circle as fast as possible. Rick P has been preaching this for years... and he's definitely not alone.

Also... once you get some flexion in your elbow... is it extending into release, or simply internally rotating through it? I see a lot of younger pitchers muscling through release... locking the angle into the elbow.

If you want better flexion in the backside of your FULL circle, get it at 12, not at 9. Form an early hook before 12... and as long as your hand isn't rotating over the top (outwards)... it should be MORE persistent.

Don't "miss the whip". Where is your release point? Although there are many forces adding to the speed of the ball... where to you think they culminate into the highest speed? Take a look at these gifs - they show the speed (in pixels) as the ball works through the whip:

Although this is not exactly what is happening... it's helpful to see when trying to understand the best place to release the ball:

A and V are the acceleration and velocity vectors...

Velocity is greatest when at a VERTICAL position. Now... if you look at those pitchers again (above)... when is the best time to release the ball? When it's vertical. Where is that in relation to our body? On the back leg... where your arm is VERTICAL to its attachment point (the shoulder). Not in the slot... or off the front leg. Sure... many release 'in the slot'... but their fingers are usually releasing at vertical. Don't miss this opportunity to maximize your whip... you can see how much the arm slows down once it gets beyond vertical.

I feel like more info on the actual "whip" portion of IR might help me, DD, and possibly others in the same situation. Thanks again for all the hard work!

Thanks for the compliments! Let me know if you need more... hopefully this is what you were after... ~JS

 

[javasource]

Flaws & Fixes: Pseudo I/R Supplement

Intro to Articulations of the Forearm, Elbow, & Shoulder

Although the main focus of this thread has been Drive Mechanics, a huge influx of recent PM’s has me typing similar responses over and over again… so I figured this is as good as a place as any to post some thoughts… but beware… these will be another series of my “over the top” posts (literally and figuratively).

Most of what we'll discuss involves finite adjustments to an existing understanding and utilization of proper I/R mechanics. BM knows his shiznit… get it from him directly on these threads FIRST (Internal Rotation and I/R in the Classroom). Learn it properly… and then use my input in this thread as a way to fine tune that engine, if necessary. These posts are intended to address common issues I see as a PC for EXISTING I/R mechanics… not to teach the fundamentals.

Good PC’s aren’t at everyone’s fingertips… and for many, good PC’s aren’t affordable. Yes, these posts will be very ‘detailed’… as I choose not to insult or limit those that desire more. You can run away from these details if you choose, but understanding them will go a long way in helping your DD get the most out of her pitch… regardless of her PC or lack thereof.

A Basic Understanding

Before we get started, it’s important that you realize a couple things first… and as such, this will need to be a multi-post.

IMO, a powerful drive, great arm-whip, and great timing… are the three absolutes that all pitchers should master. Mastering these elements can be more easily attained if you turn your focus to what the joints are doing… or articulations.

Good timing - something I will discuss in subsequent posts - is a requisite for much of what we will be discussing. If your DD has difficulty opening her shoulder line BEFORE passing over-top… I recommend you fix that now. Aggressively driving out is a requirement… because it opens the hips and then the shoulders… ALLOWING for the shoulder complex to be in a good position for the arm to elevate and pass over-top. Again, we’ll cover that in more detail… later.

Here is a preview… and some baseline points… of things these next series of posts will discuss:

• Extension (straightening) of the arm occurs at the elbow. The opposite is flexion (bend).
• Pronation and Supination are articulations (movements) that occur in the forearm.
• Medial (or Internal) rotation and lateral (or external) rotation are articulations (movements) that occur in the shoulder (humerus).
• The forearm and shoulder can - and often do - act independently of one another (i.e. I/R of the humerus does not force pronation of the forearm).
• In forearm articulations… Neutral means the forearm is oriented so that the hand is in handshaking position (think palm-to-third at 9), Supinated means that the forearm is oriented so that the palm is UP, Pronated means that the forearm is oriented so the palm is DOWN. For an illustration of this... SEE THE LAST POST (Post 141).

Here are a few other, super important things to know, and the true subject of the following ‘lessons’:

• The biceps is an ELBOW FLEXOR and SUPINATOR.
• The triceps is an ELBOW EXTENDOR and PRONATOR.
• The bones of the forearm are the Ulna and the Radius.
• The Ulna has NO movement in Pronation and Supination… so the muscles attached to it (like the brachialis) play no role in those articulations.
• The Radius is the mover in forearm articulations… so DESIRED forearm positions (pronation and supination) are best attained when the muscles attached are highly activated or deactivated (like the biceps brachii, etc.).
• The triceps is attached to the Ulna.
• The humerus should slightly ELEVATE and EXTERNALLY rotate over the top of the arm circle.
• Differences in joint laxity and general body composition prevent absolutes. Elbow flexion will vary between athletes. Although it’s NOT an absolute, I’ve found that tall/thin girls have a little less ‘natural’ angle (elbow) in the backside of the circle than those of different body-types. Don’t get caught up on a magical number… but work towards attaining some level of flexion, as the resulting ‘lag’ it creates… is HIGHLY desirable.

Why is knowing this important? Couple of things to consider as you digest this info… here are some of the most commonly asked questions I receive (in no particular order):

1. My daughters hand is rotating (palm-to-3rd or palm-down) over top. How do I fix it?
2. My daughters arm circle appears to have a slight pause (or hitch) over top? How do I fix it?
3. My daughters arm straightens after it passes over the top. How do I help her keep it bent some?
4. My daughter has a little pain in her shoulder. What might cause this?
5. My daughter releases the ball too late. How do I help her with this?
6. How do I improve my daughters speed and spin?
7. My PC says bringing the ball up the circle with palm-up will help create bend… so why does the bend go away after she goes over top?

Truth is… the answers to each of these questions are contained above… but I’m a detail-junkie, and I won’t assume you know (hence my level of ‘detail’). I'll be sure to step through each of the points above... and hopefully you'll all walk away from these posts with a deeper knowledge of 'why'... and use this to help others pitch with better results. This time of year is my busy time... so hang in there... I'll try to get through these posts over the next few weeks. Best, ~JS