More questions on DBSF and the 12-to-6 swing

CoogansBluff said:

Another observation I make when watching Miggy over and over is how quickly (compared to lower-level hitters) that his top hand 'overtakes' his bottom hand to contact, or should I say how quickly and fluidly that he turns the barrel. It's not just that it's a 12-to-6 swing, but that the hand on that clock is moving smoothly and consistently. Most TB hitters, even good ones who swing 12-to-6, take hands to the ball w/ a slow (or no) hand pivot. They sorta extend arms at the ball to hit it and don't continue the barrel turn/whip. They might eventually get the barrel turned, but the journey stalls around 9 p.m. and has to regain speed.

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pattar said:

You could probably easily say the same thing when comparing him to other MLB hitters..it is why he is one of the top hitters of the last 25 years.

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They might eventually get the barrel turned, but the journey stalls around 9 p.m. and has to regain speed.

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Gags said:

At the levels I coach, I haven't had to try to explain this yet (although I do use the "hands above the ball" at times). I know I've read here or elsewhere that the front elbow is a key. Visually, it's easier to point out that the front shoulder "clears out" more on a high pitch. And by shoulder I mean the actual socket/joint, not the shoulder blade, b/c after looking at Noon's gif the 4GD posted, the shoulder blades (using the name on the jersey as a reference) appear to maintain very similar angles on both swings at contact (willing to be corrected on this if there's a way to "pause" the gifs).

But as a teach / cue, I would ignore mention of the shoulder. If I were to focus on clearing my shoulder out on a high pitch, I would expect to have more of an arm bar (which I'm trying to remove from my own swing), b/c I'd be leaving my hands behind. I think if you use the elbow as a cue, your arms and hands maintain that box shape better. But like I mentioned, I haven't taught this yet. Maybe leading with the elbow is just a re-wording of the "hands to the ball" cue?

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Greenmonsters said:

Better and easier to grasp IMO if you use barrel to the ball as the cue and explain that the hands are responsible for launching the barrel and the rest of the body does what it needs to to support a successful launch

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FP26 said:

I agree. Another cue I have used for this is get the barrel "behind and through" the ball.

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dominik said:

BTW the swing is never really 12-6 unless you want to hit a ball that would hit your knee. the swing is always a disc starting at the front shoulder and that disc is tilted. if the pitch is high that disc is almost Level and if the pitch is low that is tilted closer to 12-6 but never really 12-6.

the steepest angles are about 60 degrees down on really low and in pitches.

here is trout who is about the closest to 12-6 that you can get
JABO: Mike Trout Has a New Trick | FanGraphs Baseball

however it can help to think 12-6 on low pitches because centrifugal force tends to pull the bat angle up (just like a chair swing ride)

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