Wrist Snaps

[RayR]

Been playing around with wrist actions pertaining to windmill, OH throwing, hitting and other sports (hockey and tennis for example) and have come to the conclusion that the wrist snapping proponents have it mostly right.

The more I focus on the wrist snapping though release (windmill) the more velocity I get along with a sense of less effort and more accuracy. BUT, I am not forcing a follow though to the throwing shoulder - I am allowing the follow though to flow naturally and it is usually ending with the hand turning over and finishing across my body.

The other sense I get is that the more I try to snap at release the more my body tries to support that goal. And as I try to work location (say low in the zone) the more I feel my body doing something different. Mostly like I am supporting the wrist snap, but trying to stay on top more to promote an earlier release so the ball stays down.

It is kind of like throwing with more of a purpose as opposed to just throwing. The difference between aiming the ball and snapping to a target is the best way I can put it.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Ray

 

[BoardMember]

Ray, if this is what you mean by "wrist snap" then yes, good pitchers snap their wrists........

Internal rotation of the humerus/forearm, coupled with some last second wrist extension/ulnar deviation......

 

[RayR]

Yes, BM - I am saying that exactly - that's why I said the wrist snap advocates had it mostly right - but the follow through was forced. If you think of snapping the ball though release like the girl is showing you end up (hopefully) changing how get your arm into a position to allow that to happen.

Most pitching coaches around here push a straight up follow through and don't allow the hand/arm to finish naturally. I believe this changes how the arm comes through its circle.

I also help coach a boys LL team 10-12 YO. I help the pitchers. One thing that I constantly help them with is when I see the ball sliding out of their hand at release. We work on snapping the ball at release and increase in velocity is immediate as well as accuracy.

BM, you will probably appreciate this - My golf swing is pretty hideous (long and wrong) as I just usually swing as hard as I can and come over the top. A power fade would be an accurate description when all things are right. I have been working on getting my bottom hand to snap though impact. Immediate improvement and have been able to draw the ball. My finish has the club head turning over during follow through - never did that before.

I can apply this wrist action to every sport, but it seems to get over looked. Watch a tennis player and how they hit a forehand to create top spin. How about how you shoot a basketball? Throw a tight spiral with a football. For hockey fans - take a slap shot and focus on the bottom hand snapping through the shot. Throw a frisbee. Swing a bat and focus on the top hand snappng though and past the bottom hand (NOT ROLLING OVER) at contact. Badminton? Throw a dart?

Let me be clear that wrist action is in itself a cure all, but is certainly a huge part of the puzzle. Snapping the wrist allows the ball to spin off the fingers faster to add more speed and/or movement to a pitch.

My opinion is that elite and close to elite players get it done using different styles, but all of them have an innate sense on how to release the ball. And this innate sense of how the ball should be released influences their style and larger muscle actions.

 

[BoardMember]

BM, you will probably appreciate this - My golf swing is pretty hideous (long and wrong) as I just usually swing as hard as I can and come over the top. A power fade would be an accurate description when all things are right. I have been working on getting my bottom hand to snap though impact. Immediate improvement and have been able to draw the ball. My finish has the club head turning over during follow through - never did that before.

Learning to release the club head is VERY MUCH like pitching a softball. Elite pitchers create/maintain a supinated orientation of the forearm on the way down the circle (ball facing the sky) at the 3 oclock position. As the forearm/wrist pass through the Coronal plane, the forearm/wrist rotate quickly to a pronated position as a function of the body knowing what the most natural pressure free position of the limbs are at any given postion in the body plane.

In the golf swing, IF you think of starting the right forearm in the supinated position at address, IE strong grip of the right hand and right forearm facing up, with the left forearm facing neutral, IE facing the right forearm.......And make a golf swing.......Your right forearm/wrist WILL turn over as the arm passes the Coronal plane......As it seeks a pressure free position forward of the Coronal plane........The result is of course a draw ball path...........Also, starting with the supinated forearm/hand position will keep the right elbow "tucked" vs. "flying".........Which enhances the inside/out path through contact.........

Once you've mastered that path, hitting a fade is as simple as taking a weaker grip with the right arm with the right forearm facing more neutral via a weaker position on the grip causing less rotation as the right arm passes the Coronal plane.......

You don't have to change the left arm/hand orientation ever........Just adjust the grip of the right hand/arm to control the amount of NATURAL rotation through contact........

Watch Tigers down swing, and notice he maintains a supinated position of the right forearm until just before contact, then as it passes the Coronal plane it automatically turns over to a pronated position through extension........Pronation is what "throws" the club head (or softball) through release........



The left wrist's job is simply to stay "flat" through the entire golf swing.......

 

[3DD'sDAD]

BM - I apologize for the ignorance, but what are you referring to as the "Coronal plane"? I have been "teaching" IR to my DD and she has shown significant improvement. Thank you for your posts realted to that. It has proven to be invaluable. To strengthen the forearm, I have started using weighted balls from the 9 o'clock position. Do you have any specific drills that will help ingrain that natural move? DD's PC is questioning IR and suggests that the ball be facing third base (righty) and ensure that the hand remains "behind the ball" so that the wrist can snap better. I feel that the natural movement of the forearm when externally rotated will create enough whip with some wrist snap as shown in the video above. The PC really wants DD's pitching hand to be almost bent to the maximum to create the snap. She did not believe me when I suggested that the ball face the sky to create whip. Any suggestions, other than changing PC?

 

[RayR]

Elite pitchers create/maintain a supinated orientation of the forearm on the way down the circle (ball facing the sky) at the 3 oclock position. As the forearm/wrist pass through the Coronal plane, the forearm/wrist rotate quickly to a pronated position as a function of the body knowing what the most natural pressure free position of the limbs are at any given postion in the body plane.

Exactly my point that the mind and body will accomodate the end goal. Elite players have an innate sense of this - good athletes can be shown this and incorporate it - call them grinders.

 

[Hillhouse]

The more I focus on the wrist snapping though release (windmill) the more velocity I get along with a sense of less effort and more accuracy. BUT, I am not forcing a follow though to the throwing shoulder - I am allowing the follow though to flow naturally and it is usually ending with the hand turning over and finishing across my body.

It sounds like you're not snapping the wrist. You're snapping Elbow, wrist and fingers in the right sequence. If so, that's great.

Doing "wrist flips" as they are commonly seen and taught is, perhaps, the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen. Sure they are working their wrist... as they neglect their elbow and teach themselves to pitch with a straight arm and no elbow snap. Ever see a baseball pitcher lock his elbow and warm up his wrist with doing a wrist flip above his head? Me either.

Bill

 

[littlereddeer1]

So what is the best way to pracitce wrist snaps? Should you be isolating the wrist snaps? That is part of the warm-up that I do with my daughter every practice.

 

[SBFAMILY]

Good post Bill. See way too many kids taught the wrong way.

 

[BoardMember]

Doing "wrist flips" as they are commonly seen and taught is, perhaps, the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen.

I completely agree with this statement......

This instructor is teaching "wrist flips"......And incorrectly refering to them as "wrist snaps" IMO..........

In my original Internal Rotation thread I identified this type of instruction as being possibly the worst drill/technique taught to young pitchers in fastpitch softball IMO........



My interpetation of "wrist snaps" (which I teach) is to create actions upstream that cause the wrist to "snap" or "snaps the wrist" through sequencing and reverse chaining.

"Wrist Snaps" should always be performed using a minimum of 1/4 circle drills with I/R (IE the 3:00 drill), and are optimized by progressing to my "show it and throw it" drill which continues to engage a larger cross section of articulations of the muscles and joints involved in the delivery.......