Turning the barrel and launch position

[efastball]

If I slot the back elbow and ...

Early (MLB) TTB is over by then

This is one of the critical differences between high level and youth swings.

 

[RichK]

If I slot the back elbow and work the front elbow above the ball at the same time from a leveraged position, the barrel turns, the triangle rotates. I don't have to think about TTB with the hands at all. That's not saying I think the hands are dead

I teach a triangle turn. I do think the elbows need to work together properly -- front elbow 'rides up the ramp' (or left or right, inside/outside) to the appropriate pitch location. Back elbow keeps its proper relationship to the front elbow.

Slam the V into a stop swing (via a heavy bag) is something I think can be a very useful teaching tool, especially for younger hitters.

That said, I still like the hitter to be executing that triangle turn by working the barrel between her hands....

In other words (reversing your phrase), if I work the hands properly, I don't have to think about the triangle turn at all

 

[julray]

I teach a triangle turn. I do think the elbows need to work together properly -- front elbow 'rides up the ramp' (or left or right, inside/outside) to the appropriate pitch location. Back elbow keeps its proper relationship to the front elbow.

Slam the V into a stop swing (via a heavy bag) is something I think can be a very useful teaching tool, especially for younger hitters.

That said, I still like the hitter to be executing that triangle turn by working the barrel between her hands....

In other words (reversing your phrase), if I work the hands properly, I don't have to think about the triangle turn at all

I can understand that.. and maybe for some hitters that works. My DD may not be strong enough in hands area, because when we initially tried this(hands) she would lose control of the barrel and dump it every time, what a nightmare that was.

But if I pick up a bat and attempt what you are saying, I don't have to think about the elbows or RTT.. but is this what happens in a HL swing.. are they thinking about TTB with hands?

 

[julray]

Early (MLB) TTB is over by then

This is one of the critical differences between high level and youth swings.

So you believe that in a high level swing TTB happens with the hands and then the process of elbow slot is initiated... I see all this occurring in unison. Of course the great debate is what turns the barrel, I'm still not convinced it's the isolated movement of the hands

 

[julray]

Question, do any of you actually pick up a bat try some of the crap we are talking about? , I don't mean that as an insult, just curious if you guys are video analysis strictly or like a more practical approach of picking up the lumber and swinging it?

 

[FP26]

Question, do any of you actually pick up a bat try some of the crap we are talking about? , I don't mean that as an insult, just curious if you guys are video analysis strictly or like a more practical approach of picking up the lumber and swinging it?

I can't speak for others, but I swing quite a bit. In the last 12 months, I have not had as much opportunity as I would like to swing off live pitching, but I still work in a cage as often as I can.

 

[julray]

I can't speak for others, but I swing quite a bit. In the last 12 months, I have not had as much opportunity as I would like to swing off live pitching, but I still work in a cage as often as I can.

Cool, yes I like to get a feel for the things we discuss. There have been quite a few light bulb moments over the past 3 years

 

[Cornbread]

So you believe that in a high level swing TTB happens with the hands and then the process of elbow slot is initiated... I see all this occurring in unison. Of course the great debate is what turns the barrel, I'm still not convinced it's the isolated movement of the hands

If the hands and upper body resist as long as possible, wouldn’t the triangle be created and maintained? I swing too and when I resist hard with the upper body my obliques engage like crazy and my lead elbow works higher. Once I start thinking about thinking about a hand movement my obliques disengage and all my focus goes to my hands. That’s just my swing feelings

 

[RichK]

Question, do any of you actually pick up a bat try some of the crap we are talking about? , I don't mean that as an insult, just curious if you guys are video analysis strictly or like a more practical approach of picking up the lumber and swinging it?

I hit all the time, up until this fall had a cage in my backyard (finally gave my yard back to my wife). I've both coached and given lessons to players I've coached (never as a full-time instructor). When I was learning some of this 'new stuff' after finding DFP and other outlets my wife used to make fun of me for practicing coiling while walking through the store and hand pivots while driving

My kids are through softball now, I continued coaching an 18U exposure team for a handful of years after they moved on from it. I took a break this year but am thinking about helping with a younger team starting this fall. I like to talk/coach hitting, it's interesting to me. To that end I like to share what's worked for me as I've been learning. I don't have a lot of interest in arguing. But I'm enjoying this conversation

 

[julray]

If the hands and upper body resist as long as possible, wouldn’t the triangle be created and maintained? I swing too and when I resist hard with the upper body my obliques engage like crazy and my lead elbow works higher. Once I start thinking about thinking about a hand movement my obliques disengage and all my focus goes to my hands. That’s just my swing feelings

I think there's more to it than that. My DD was resisting and barrel path was still messed up, triangle was not maintained. elbows got glued to her side. Maybe you are just doing it naturally or somewhere along the way you learned to maintain the triangle.. I believe it's more than just resistance.