throwing at runners

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radness

Possibilities & Opportunities!
Dec 13, 2019
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clearly defines it (and it is not additional, it is the running lane they should be in), and also might serve as visual reminder for BR.
Just called it additional cuz so much of the time it is left out.

But does define the space
they should be in!
 
Feb 13, 2021
880
93
MI
is runner in lane or out of it when both feet are off ground


In or out of RL is defined as last point of contact with the ground. Position of the rest of the body has no bearing on in or out of RL.

I have never had to make this call but if/when it occurs it all comes down to umpire's judgment on where the runner had last established herself. As a HC all you need to hear is, "Coach, in my judgment she last touched the ground (inside or outside as the case may be) of the running lane and that is why she is (not out or out as the case may be)."

EDIT: The above statement SHOULD reassure you that the umpire knows the rule and also knows enough to tell you just what he saw that he is basing the ruling on.
 
May 6, 2015
2,397
113
by that logic, bouncing ball that strikes fair, goes past 1b or 3B in air in foul territory, should be fair, it is where it last touched.

if umpires are expected to make that judgment call while ball is in the air moving up to 100 mph, why cannot they make same deterination for a BR running less than 20 mph? honestly much easier to judge that than which foot hit last where when ball hit them.

like I said, it is an absurdly/stupidly worded rule. the foot is not blocking the throw, the body/arms are (would you call the batter out if throw hit the foot?).

and no, actually the human brain cannot focus on both (ball and foot) at once, it is simply not the way the brain is wired. some people move back and forth faster, but the brain is actually focusing on one or the other at any given split second/instant

no other aspect of the rules has anything like this (both feet in box, but leaning over plate, hit by pitch, it is a strike, not a base awarded, even if feet were in a safe haven).
 
Feb 13, 2021
880
93
MI
no other aspect of the rules has anything like this

Sure there is, Out of play/dead ball area that is a chalk line rather than a fence/wall/barrier. Fielder catches fly ball before foot lands in dead ball area, it is an out and runner advance 2 bases from time of pitch. If caught after foot touches dead ball area, it is just a foul ball, no out no runner advance. Bang bang play on a force out, was ball in mitt before runner touched base, slap hitter on nearly any hit, was foot on the ground out of the box before the bat hit the ball, runner leaving early There are plenty of times an umpire needs to see two thing at once. We are very talented when it come to multi-tasking.
 
May 6, 2015
2,397
113
Sure there is, Out of play/dead ball area that is a chalk line rather than a fence/wall/barrier. Fielder catches fly ball before foot lands in dead ball area, it is an out and runner advance 2 bases from time of pitch. If caught after foot touches dead ball area, it is just a foul ball, no out no runner advance. Bang bang play on a force out, was ball in mitt before runner touched base, slap hitter on nearly any hit, was foot on the ground out of the box before the bat hit the ball, runner leaving early There are plenty of times an umpire needs to see two thing at once. We are very talented when it come to multi-tasking.
I was talking about going back and forth A/B/A/B/A/B, that kinda of situation. the wslap hitter is not dancing in/out of the box, the fielder is not going to dance his feet, one over line and one not, etc.

again, stupidly worded rule. but, I will be certain going forward to tell runners to run right foot on the foul line, maximum chance of being in way of throw and pretty much completely protected, unless hit exactly at a momentn when left foot is on ground. the whole while in contact pretty much obliterates the purpose of the running lane. stupid that one moment they are interfering, then the next, with no lateral movement whatsoever, the runner is not. just a horribly worded rule. I would think umpires agree, as if the body of the runner is in lane or not while watching throw is much easier, can be determined by viewing directly down the baseline.
 
May 29, 2019
269
63
I think people are way overthinking this. Keep it simple. Call it as you see it. "Judgement call, coach....that's what I saw...move on"

As far as beaning runners outside of the running lane goes; you should be teaching your defenders to create throwing lanes. People think they are being smart by teaching to get outs by way of the rule book (yes, there have been threads on here where people advocating purposely throwing at runners to get the out by interference; that's soooooo Bush league). However, there may a point where you really need that out but don't get that call. Don't blame the umpire when that happens.
 

softgabby

Gear Empress
Mar 10, 2016
1,073
83
Just behind home plate
During a HS game a Catcher threw at a runner at first with a runner at 2nd with no outs. I commented that that was not a play the catcher should make in a close game, Immediately I had another parent say he would do it every time if he was coaching. I made the comment that if the opposing coach was paying attention the runner would have been in scoring position. I even commented that smart baserunners will punish the defense on those type plays. In the game also she threw at a runner taking second and let a run score (she got the out and the run scored, we won easily so it did not matter)
What is everyone thought on when catchers should throw at runners on base in pick off attempts or on steal attempts
If a baserunner is giving me an opportunity like that to throw her out trying to steal, you better believe I'm taking it. As a catcher, you have to have faith that your defense has your back because you sure have theirs. You have to have faith that your defense is going to make you look good as your giving them every opportunity to do their on field job.

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softgabby

Gear Empress
Mar 10, 2016
1,073
83
Just behind home plate
Back pick whenever and where ever an out can be made.

Catcher should already be aware of lead off distances of the runners. Directly apon that 'intent to throw moment'.
If a runner is FAR off 2nd. That may be better to pick there.
As it could be a delay play.
Watching runners body posture and weight shift is a learned skill.

It should be noted that the same throwing mechanics can be a back pick to 2nd or 1st base.
Would not want my runner on 2nd to relax by any means with a catcher who is capable.
Getting back to the base is critical, not to be tinkered with.

Both runners often will/have already turned to get back to their bases.
Simply, Back picks, in most cases, trigger runners to return to their base.

Communication from other infielders should be enough to counter a delay runner attempting to then go to 3rd from 2nd.
This exactly. I'm constantly watching baserunners. I'll just casually shift my eyes to see what the baserunners at first and third are doing and what kind of lead they're getting. I just had a game yesterday where I back picked a runner napping off first. I just made the decision as she wasn't watching the pitcher. And zap! Got her napping.

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softgabby

Gear Empress
Mar 10, 2016
1,073
83
Just behind home plate
Depends on the skill level of the players, and the game situation. If the fielders have the quickness and arm strength to be able to get the second out a high percentage of the time, I'm okay with C being aggressive with her throwing. If it's a medium-percentage play on the first out due to the quality of the fielders or the throwing abilities of C, it's probably better to hold the ball. There are a lot of variables in these decisions, including game score.

On my DD's TB team, there is a much higher percentage of getting outs. On her HS team, not so much. She adjusts accordingly.
I do this too where I'll adapt my strategy to the game situation.

If it's early in the game...I'll be aggressive as I know there is time to get a run back. But late in game and the game's close...I won't take the risk unless I know I can get get out.

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