The Texas Charge folded

[Gtrips07]

I was under the impression that by far more men are sports spectators than women. I don't expect an equal percentage of women to attend sporting events as men do. Would you agree that the majority of men would not attend a woman's sporting event, even if the quality of play of the women's teams were equal to or better the men's teams?

Why would you expect ment to watch women's sports more than men??
Under the impression is not a statstical measurment that can be analyzed and evaluated.

And you didn't answer the question why attendance is not an issue in the WCWS and the SEC.

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[Elk Grove Hurricane]

Seeing women are about 52-53% of the population too they must be sexists as well. And if men are sexists why does the SEC and Women's College World Series sellout??

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I don't know anyone who thinks that only sexism explains the NPF struggles, but explain why ESPN broadcasts the Cornhole "World Championships" and not the NPF without sexism. I can't.

 

[Gtrips07]

I don't know anyone who thinks that only sexism explains the NPF struggles, but explain why ESPN broadcasts the Cornhole "World Championships" and not the NPF without sexism. I can't.

Supply and demand, it is simple as that. Capitalism isn't sexists. Also poor marketing and management isn't sexists as well.

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[marriard]

I have expressed my views on NPF before here. The model for the league is wrong but they keep doing the same thing time and time again. They want to run it as a 'national' full-time pro league instead of building up to it. This model continues to fail for most non-established sports and even for established sports which are not originally propped up until they can support themselves or support themselves enough to have other tangible benefits (NBA has done this with the WNBA and their G-League, MLB with their minor system)

The model is expensive especially in team sports. It also has difficulty marketing because most of the money is in travel budgets are out of line which means less money for marketing and there is less chance of local ties or rivalries or team continuation year to year. They need to rethink how everything is done.

There are other models to explore - the Japanese model (corporate sponsored teams where the players make as much of their money working as they do playing) & the Pro Lacrosse models (very regionally focused) come to mind and I am sure there are others. USSSA and Scrapyard are teams where they are using the teams to better market who they are rather than the other way around. These teams seem to have their own models to survive and are clearly not relying on ticket sales to survive.

Establishing and growing the league are steps they seem to want to just skip. It wasn't all that long ago that NBA and NFL players had off-season jobs. There is nothing wrong with establishing semi-pro, or barely-pro or even organized high level amateur adult leagues and then building up from these.

I may not have the best model ideas - but I do know the current model is more of a 'hanging on another year survival' situation and that is not feasible long term.

 

[Eric F]

Many generalizations to follow...

Men's sports are faster and more dynamic than the women's side of the same sport (basketball is a good example). This is just the nature of the difference in physical size and power of the athletes. Related to that, fans are attracted to seeing sports played at the highest level (fastest, highest scoring, etc.), which is the men's game. The revenue of a bigger fan base is additionally compounded by more sponsorship money targeting that larger fan base. The reality of the business side is that if there is more revenue, there is more money for salaries, facilities, etc. You can't pay athletes if the money isn't there. IMO, sexism has very little to do with it.

 

[Bob516]

Why would you expect ment to watch women's sports more than men??
Under the impression is not a statstical measurment that can be analyzed and evaluated.

And you didn't answer the question why attendance is not an issue in the WCWS and the SEC.

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I don't expect men to watch men to watch women's sports more than men's sports, but they do not come even close to watching women's sports at the same percentage as they do of men's sports. There are plenty of women who attend men's sports, but there are not plenty of men who attend women's sports. In the last World Cup games, the attendance at the women's world cup was 70% of the attendance of the men's games.

Selling out the WCWS is not the issue, it is an issue of total attendance. The WCWS attendance average was 7,680, the men's world series average attendance per game was 22,352, as reported by the NCAA. More people attend the CWS than the WCWS. Do the men such play a superior game that so many more people should turn out to watch the CWS than the WCWS?

 

[WaNole]

Poor model and owners/GMs don't know what they're doing save for the pride. You have some of the best players in the league sitting on the bench for the pride because they're the only ones that know how to draft.

You also have no tv access unless you pay for a subscription to the net. Wth.

Play in college towns in college stadiums. Have the college player from that school play on those teams. Chicago, Dallas Akron and Pittsburgh aren't softball hotbeds. Stay in the SE and limit travel.

 

[Gtrips07]

I don't expect men to watch men to watch women's sports more than men's sports, but they do not come even close to watching women's sports at the same percentage as they do of men's sports. There are plenty of women who attend men's sports, but there are not plenty of men who attend women's sports. In the last World Cup games, the attendance at the women's world cup was 70% of the attendance of the men's games.

Selling out the WCWS is not the issue, it is an issue of total attendance. The WCWS attendance average was 7,680, the men's world series average attendance per game was 22,352, as reported by the NCAA. More people attend the CWS than the WCWS. Do the men such play a superior game that so many more people should turn out to watch the CWS than the WCWS?

What was the stadium size of the two?
Are women being sexists because they watch men's sports more than women's sports?

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[Gtrips07]

I don't expect men to watch men to watch women's sports more than men's sports, but they do not come even close to watching women's sports at the same percentage as they do of men's sports. There are plenty of women who attend men's sports, but there are not plenty of men who attend women's sports. In the last World Cup games, the attendance at the women's world cup was 70% of the attendance of the men's games.

Selling out the WCWS is not the issue, it is an issue of total attendance. The WCWS attendance average was 7,680, the men's world series average attendance per game was 22,352, as reported by the NCAA. More people attend the CWS than the WCWS. Do the men such play a superior game that so many more people should turn out to watch the CWS than the WCWS?

You still haven't answered why the SEC draws standing room only and there are teams building new stadiums that are larger.

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[Eric F]

I have expressed my views on NPF before here. The model for the league is wrong but they keep doing the same thing time and time again. They want to run it as a 'national' full-time pro league instead of building up to it. This model continues to fail for most non-established sports and even for established sports which are not originally propped up until they can support themselves or support themselves enough to have other tangible benefits (NBA has done this with the WNBA and their G-League, MLB with their minor system)

The model is expensive especially in team sports. It also has difficulty marketing because most of the money is in travel budgets are out of line which means less money for marketing and there is less chance of local ties or rivalries or team continuation year to year. They need to rethink how everything is done.

There are other models to explore - the Japanese model (corporate sponsored teams where the players make as much of their money working as they do playing) & the Pro Lacrosse models (very regionally focused) come to mind and I am sure there are others. USSSA and Scrapyard are teams where they are using the teams to better market who they are rather than the other way around. These teams seem to have their own models to survive and are clearly not relying on ticket sales to survive.

Establishing and growing the league are steps they seem to want to just skip. It wasn't all that long ago that NBA and NFL players had off-season jobs. There is nothing wrong with establishing semi-pro, or barely-pro or even organized high level amateur adult leagues and then building up from these.

I may not have the best model ideas - but I do know the current model is more of a 'hanging on another year survival' situation and that is not feasible long term.

Agreed.

IMO...Another area where NPF has failed is putting teams in markets where the potential fan base is largest. So Cal being the first. So Cal has one of the highest (if not the highest) population of softball players in the country, and the sport happens at the youth level all year long. There isn't a team anywhere near the west coast. Marketing a local NPF team in this area wouldn't be rocket science.