The level of coaches & umpires

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Mar 10, 2020
734
63
I don't sit in the stands..too many idiots like you there complaining about the umpires...
You are laughable that when you are faced with people who have common sense intelligence and you try to argue against it that you start calling names and trying to deface who you're speaking to. Laughable because you are already in agreement that not all umpires do a good job. You just don't have the backbone to say that you agree to common sense.
Umpires that officiate the game correctly have less harassment on the field.
It is what it is. Coaches who do a good job and develop players have a better seasons because they are able to pick up better players and families want to stay with their teams. It is what it is.
 
Jun 8, 2016
16,118
113
You are laughable that when you are faced with people who have common sense intelligence and you try to argue against it that you start calling names and trying to deface who you're speaking to. Laughable because you are already in agreement that not all umpires do a good job. You just don't have the backbone to say that you agree to common sense.
Umpires that officiate the game correctly have less harassment on the field.
It is what it is. Coaches who do a good job and develop players have a better seasons because they are able to pick up better players and families want to stay with their teams. It is what it is.
Common sense intelligence? I guess you are assuming that because I am a professor I don't have that. I don't remember having to fail a "common sense intelligence" test in order to get my job but ok. Also, saying anything to anybody on the internet doesn't require an ounce of backbone but you keep thinking you are the Teddy Roosevelt of DFP..

If you think you can apply consumerism to everything then go right ahead. I don't agree with that sentiment. Parents berating an umpire during the game does nothing to improve the product.
 
Last edited:
Feb 13, 2021
880
93
MI
Questioning the umpire's ability to officiate the correct rules is a problem that's not the parent's nor coaches fault. That is all on the umpires who are getting it wrong.
I will agree that the umpires need to know the rules, inside and out. That being said, how often does the loud-mouth in the stands or in the dugout not have the rule correct? "Hands are part of the bat" "Tie goes to the runner" ""A fly in shallow outfield can't be an IFF" "She has to slide on a force play" How many time have you heard, or worse said, any of these? And honestl;y, more umpires get jacked up over judgment rather than rules knowledge to start with.

I( know it is a cliché by now, but when was the last time someone went to your place of employment, sat back and yelled at you for getting something wrong?

"Hey, kick your seeing-eye dog, he has been lying to you all day long. Don't you know that business letters get double spaced? What kind of typist are you?"

""Hey, teacher, what do you mean my kid was late getting to class? She was there by a step and a half. You were wrong last week too, when you marked her off for a missing comma. Fercrissakes, what is it, you hate my daughter? You DO know that mistake on a 7th grade book report is going to cost her a scholarship, right?"

I will tell you what (the general you, not you personally) When parents can pass the same certification test that I need to to officiate AND have worked 3 games, then they can bitch at me all they want about rules and/or judgment. By then they will know what the rule actually is, and they will realize just how little time you have to worry about whose 'little suzy' you are calling out and it is NEVER personal.
 
May 10, 2021
149
43
Wonder the percentage that happens no evaluation pitch calls n mechanics???
The only umpires I know getting any evaluation usually ask for it and want to move up levels. Great umpires want to be critiqued and improve their game too.

There are clinics that have "live" games and umpires get evaluated too. It is all great feedback. Let me point out the percentage of umpires that take constructive criticism well is pretty low. Many "this is the way I have always done it" umpires.

My guess to the percentage of umpires that have NEVER been evaluated in travel ball? In the lower levels (B,C) probably 75%. Higher levels the percentage goes lower. Maybe they were evaluated in a cage or simulation.....most have not been evaluated by a UIC or mentor.

A really good partner could give you some positive feedback and things to work on in your postgame; but in travel they are all back to back and the opportunities are limited.

IMO a great idea would be to strengthen the site supervisor role and have the UIC (if there is one) doing regular evaluations. Some higher end tourneys have this but most do not from my experience. Umpired need support too; especially when we blow a call.
 

radness

Possibilities & Opportunities!
Dec 13, 2019
7,270
113
The only umpires I know getting any evaluation usually ask for it and want to move up levels. Great umpires want to be critiqued and improve their game too.

There are clinics that have "live" games and umpires get evaluated too. It is all great feedback. Let me point out the percentage of umpires that take constructive criticism well is pretty low. Many "this is the way I have always done it" umpires.

My guess to the percentage of umpires that have NEVER been evaluated in travel ball? In the lower levels (B,C) probably 75%. Higher levels the percentage goes lower. Maybe they were evaluated in a cage or simulation.....most have not been evaluated by a UIC or mentor.

A really good partner could give you some positive feedback and things to work on in your postgame; but in travel they are all back to back and the opportunities are limited.

IMO a great idea would be to strengthen the site supervisor role and have the UIC (if there is one) doing regular evaluations. Some higher end tourneys have this but most do not from my experience. Umpired need support too; especially when we blow a call.
Thank you for that detailed response!
 
Jun 6, 2016
2,714
113
Chicago
More games are decided on errors on routine balls than just missing a close play.

This becomes less and less true as the definition of "routine balls" expands.

At 12u, if you just catch every easy pop up, convert ground balls right at fielders into outs, don't allow runners on dropped third, etc., you're going to win almost every game.

In Major League Baseball, those plays are made almost every time. It's the other plays, the more difficult plays, those close plays that decide most games. The trick is that our brains don't really notice the "almost" plays (and we can't really judge if other players would've made those plays). We just notice the errors on routine plays.
 
Jun 6, 2016
2,714
113
Chicago
The only umpires I know getting any evaluation usually ask for it and want to move up levels. Great umpires want to be critiqued and improve their game too.
My state association has no meaningful umpire evaluation process. They don't really care if they're good either. The umpire rating system is only used as a small component of post-season assignments.
 
Jun 6, 2016
2,714
113
Chicago
You can go around and round with your own observation that the umpires aren't always right and the parents don't have a margin to speak up. Your argument is flawed because it does not recognize that umpires make their situation worse when they are blatantly wrong. If they were apt and got rules correct they would not have the monkey on their back.
The thing is though.... parents usually don't know the rules either. I've coached with/against plenty of coaches who don't, too. (And, of course, there have been a few plays over the years where I didn't know the rule, though I'm not arguing if I don't know the rules. I'm making a note of it and looking it up later.)

Even most of the very bad umpires we've had have a better knowledge of the rules then the collective of parents who attend games.
 
Aug 25, 2019
1,066
113
The only umpires I know getting any evaluation usually ask for it and want to move up levels. Great umpires want to be critiqued and improve their game too.

There are clinics that have "live" games and umpires get evaluated too. It is all great feedback. Let me point out the percentage of umpires that take constructive criticism well is pretty low. Many "this is the way I have always done it" umpires.

My guess to the percentage of umpires that have NEVER been evaluated in travel ball? In the lower levels (B,C) probably 75%. Higher levels the percentage goes lower. Maybe they were evaluated in a cage or simulation.....most have not been evaluated by a UIC or mentor.

A really good partner could give you some positive feedback and things to work on in your postgame; but in travel they are all back to back and the opportunities are limited.

IMO a great idea would be to strengthen the site supervisor role and have the UIC (if there is one) doing regular evaluations. Some higher end tourneys have this but most do not from my experience. Umpired need support too; especially when we blow a call.
The only time I get any kind of feedback is during high school season. Varsity, JV, and middle school coaches grade umpires after the game. They are to grade rules knowledge, game mechanics, game management, etc. If the game goes well with no problems, we usually get high grades, but who knows what the coach who you upset gives you. It kind of shows who the better umpires are, but then again, I don't think they ever dropped an umpire with low grades. As for travel ball, we never get evaluated.
 

radness

Possibilities & Opportunities!
Dec 13, 2019
7,270
113
My state association has no meaningful umpire evaluation process. They don't really care if they're good either. The umpire rating system is only used as a small component of post-season assignments.


Care to offer what state?
How about what tournaments might be officiated by non-evaluation process umpires?
 

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