Taking out the Catcher

[tamss13]

Here is the scenario from this weekend's tournament.

So this weekend....1st inning and the opposing team was going home. Ball thrown to catcher. The catcher turned to tag the runner and was ran flat over. Our catcher was injured and didn't return to the game. Our catcher lost the ball an the pitcher was checking on the catcher as their runner got up and walked to home....score

The UMP gave the runner a warning and told her she should have attempted to avoid the collision. The parents and coaches were upset saying since the catcher was trying to tag her the runner had right to run though the catcher.....

so now its time expired bottom of the 4th (we were home) my daughter is in as catcher (the other catcher out due to the before mentioned collision). Game 4 to 3 we are up....same runner as above is on third. This time ball hit to 1st and 1st baseman throws to home my daughter is on the line between home and third as the ball hits her glove she got plowed by the runner. My daughter doesn't bring the ball in on the catch and the ump calls the girl out for interference with the catcher, and throws her out the game due to being warned earlier.

After checking on my DD and insuring she wasn't hurt too bad....she was hurt....The other team's parents and coaches were upset saying it was a bad call....basically catcher was blocking the path to the home plate....the UMP said no the catcher had right to catch the ball an the runner should have attempted to avoid the collision.

What is the rule? What is the proper call?

It was an ugly collision....I get it if they were charging each other, but my daughter was defenseless trying to catch the ball and got plowed....if the rule is she can't block the line for any reason then I have to teach her how to protect herself in event that situation happens again.

 

[radness]

Runner sounds like an intentional jerk.
Hope the catchers are ok!
That said
more details please~
At the collision with your dd did the runner slide and take her out?

Was the ball and runner there at the same time?

Was the catcher standing in fair territory
---in front of base line---
Generally catcher can stand just in fair territory to catch and tag leaving atleast some path to the plate.
Do you think she offered atleast that?

 

[Eric F]

A fielder does not have the right-of-way on the thrown ball. If a fielder impedes the progress of the runner before having possession of the ball, it is obstruction. However, if the fielder has possession of the ball, they can be anywhere they want, including camped out right in front of the oncoming runner.

I don't believe the runner has to make an attempt to avoid a collision, but malicious intent is cause for ejection. The way you described it, it sounds like the ump was probably correct on the ejection.

Run scores. Runner ejected.

EDIT: For plays at home, my DD generally sets up with her left foot close to the 3B-side corner of the plate, with the toes of her left foot pointed at the runner (important detail). If there is an impact with her leg, it's into the shin guard. If she turns her leg, it could be an impact on the side of the knee, which is very vulnerable (I have video of my DD doing it wrong. It's not good).

 

[tamss13]

Runner sounds like an intentional jerk.
That said
more details please~
At the collision with your dd did the runner slide and take her out?

Was the ball and runner there at the same time?

Was the catcher standing in fair territory
---in front of base line---
Generally catcher can stand just in fair territory to catch and tag leaving atleast some path to the plate.
Do you think she offered atleast that?

Its 12U ball......I told my daughter she learned the hard way today.....we will figure it out for next time

In the 1st collision the girl lowered her shoulder and trucked our catcher......but again our catcher was trying to tag her

My daughter It was bang bang.....the ball hit my DD's glove then helmet, glasses, and ball went a fling!! as my DD hit the ground hard and fast with the runner on top of her

I was at the scorers table it looked like my daughter was a step behind the base line, but my DD did have to step forward to catch the ball....so I don't know if she cleared the baseline

My goal is to understand the rule and teach my DD accordingly.....this was the 1st but will not be the last tucking she will get.......

In my head the parents could be right as I watch college softball the catcher always positions themselves to catch the ball away from the baseline then use a sweeping motion to tag the runner.

The ump said the runner had more than enough time to avoid the collision and make it home safely by running behind the catcher/My DD

 

[tamss13]

EDIT: For plays at home, my DD generally sets up with her left foot close to the 3B-side corner of the plate, with the toes of her left foot pointed at the runner (important detail). If there is an impact with her leg, it's into the shin guard. If she turns her leg, it could be an impact on the side of the knee, which is very vulnerable (I have video of my DD doing it wrong. It's not good).

If you have video of you DD doing it right could you post it? I am trying to teach her correctly.....this weekend she learned HARD

 

[Rick M]

I don't believe the runner has to make an attempt to avoid a collision, but malicious intent is cause for ejection. The way you described it, it sounds like the ump was probably correct on the ejection.

Run scores. Runner ejected.

DD’s team had a similar situation on Saturday. Runner coming home, catcher got the ball before she got there. The base runner had time to slide, but she crossed her arms in front of her and plowed into the catcher, trying to knock the ball loose.

The catcher did, in fact, drop the ball. But the ump called the runner out. Kind of the opposite of your post, no warning or ejection, but the runner was ruled out (USSSA game).


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[Strike2]

There is no "right" to run over any defensive player with or without the ball. You can't even do that in MLB any more. The first situation, particularly if there was injury, is likely malicious contact. The runner should have been called out and ejected.

In the second situation, there appears to be obstruction. However, in most sanctions that I'm aware of, a runner remaining on their feet and deliberately colliding with a stationary defensive player is malicious contact, and that supersedes obstruction. Runner is out and ejected. Sliding, unless there is a flagrant attempt to injure is not considered malicious contact.

 

[Eric F]

If you have video of you DD doing it right could you post it? I am trying to teach her correctly.....this weekend she learned HARD

Doing it right - Toes pointed to runner, catches throw from 1B across her body, rather than turning to the throw. IMO, this is text-book perfect...


Doing it wrong - Body and leg turns to catch the throw from 1B. Runner comes in hot with cleats up.


My DD was 13yo at the time on both if these plays. It was about 4 weeks before she was able to play again after the injury.

 

[Eric F]

DD’s team had a similar situation on Saturday. Runner coming home, catcher got the ball before she got there. The base runner had time to slide, but she crossed her arms in front of her and plowed into the catcher, trying to knock the ball loose.

The catcher did, in fact, drop the ball. But the ump called the runner out. Kind of the opposite of your post, no warning or ejection, but the runner was ruled out (USSSA game).


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Maybe I'm mistaken. I understood that it would be obstruction first, then ejection. I hope one of our helpful DFP umpire folks will clarify this.

 

[softgabby]

Doing it right - Toes pointed to runner, catches throw from 1B across her body, rather than turning to the throw. IMO, this is text-book perfect...


Doing it wrong - Body and leg turns to catch the throw from 1B. Runner comes in hot with cleats up.


My DD was 13yo at the time on both if these plays. It was about 4 weeks before she was able to play again after the injury.

The first example is exactly what I was taught when I was first learning the position. It's a lot safer that way if you are in a collision than if you were being trucked.

The second example just looked like a nasty injury. I've been trucked multiple times by baserunners and it never felt good.