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Still Lost on the infield fly rule

Jun 11, 2013
2,201
83
Of course we call it when the conditions are met. Why wouldn’t we? I don’t know of a single colleague who would admit to knowingly fail to make the signal and call just in spite.

But just like a coach who forgets the number of outs and sends his/her runner on a fly ball with one out, or forgets to inform the umpire of a substitution, or forgets that a foul tip is a live ball and sends a runner who stole third back to second while the ball is already in the circle, umpires have brain cramps. We’re human; it happens. Fortunately, the rules allow us to fix that.


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Of course we all mistakes from time to time. It just seems like the tone of this whole thread is that we should just know it's going to called and shouldn't rely on the umps to call it. To be fair that's the case most of the time but there are some that aren't so obvious and when they aren't caught without any signal we have to assume it's not called and send our runners or risk an easy DP as happened in the Original post here. If it's missed and retroactively applied fairly that's more than fine but the comments that "We should just know it should be called" on non obvious popups seems a little unfair. If every call was obvious we we wouldn't need umpires in the first place.
 
Nov 1, 2013
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Interesting that no one has mentioned which umpire (in a 2 or 3 person crew) is responsible to make such a call.

I just reviewed the NFHS Umpires Manual to confirm what I thought was correct...I was correct. So which umpire has the responsibility to call the Infield Fly Rule?
 
Oct 11, 2018
154
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Interesting that no one has mentioned which umpire (in a 2 or 3 person crew) is responsible to make such a call.

I just reviewed the NFHS Umpires Manual to confirm what I thought was correct...I was correct. So which umpire has the responsibility to call the Infield Fly Rule?
Plate umpire's responsibility but if I haven't heard her/him call it and its happening, I certainly will call it. [Also plate umpire's responsibility to signal partner of the situation, but he/she forgets, I'll signal it.]

Here's wording from USA umpire manual.
Infield Fly: When an umpire signals to their partner that the infield fly rule is in effect, do so prior to the pitch. The signal is made by placing the right hand and arm across the chest with the hand over the heart. It is the plate umpire’s responsibility to call the Infield Fly. When an Infield Fly is judged by the umpire
 
May 23, 2018
26
3
Ok this is driving me crazy. I posted back in june and I taught I understood the in-field fly rule from the replies to that post....then Saturday happened.....so here is the situation

No Outs. 2 scored runs in the ending. We had a runner on First and Second. The batter hit a pop fly right behind second base barely in the outfield. The girls lead off base and waited to see if the ball would be caught. it was dropped......so the girl at second had no chance of getting to third, but since the ball was dropped she taught she had a forced out....she took off to third....1st advanced to 2nd and the batter got to 1st. Once the girl advancing to third was tagged out...the ump said it was the fly rule was in effect therefor the batter was out and second was out for not retouching 1st before advancing to 2nd. So three outs

The ump didn't call the Fly Rule......the ump stated he didn't have to call it as its in effect and the girls and coaches should recognize it.

We were blowing the team out so no big deal......the coaches didn't protest too much as it would look very un-sportsman like when you are up 12 to zero in the top of the third - league only allows 5 runs an ending at 12U

But for my Education.......I am soo lost now....so a pop fly - any where - counts or is it only in the infield? If so how would the girls know? If its infield only......any pop fly would fall under this rule?? I am soooo lost...
Sounds like it should have been called. Unlike an obstruction call, which can be applied even if it’s not called on the field right away, this needs to be called immediately. You can’t go back after the fact and apply the rule. It should be noted that this is a shared responsibility between plate and base umpire. The purpose of the rule is not to prevent a cheap out, but to prevent a cheap double play. That’s the reason there is no IFR with just one runner on - it’s not to prevent a cheap out but to prevent the double play.
Both The USA and The NSA don’t allow the umps to retroactively apply the Rule.

It’s a judgment call. It’s supposed to be called when the ball reaches its apex. This is probably one of the tougher calls an ump has to make. What requires merely reasonable effort as a 14U, may require a Herculean effort at 10U or 12U. I’ve never seen both coaches be in agreement on this.
 
Oct 11, 2018
154
28
Both The USA and The NSA don’t allow the umps to retroactively apply the Rule.
Where do you read that? The fact that an umpire doesn't announce the Infield Fly at the proper time, doesn't mean he doesn't have to enforce it if he realizes it or it is brought to his attention before the next pitch. And in USA softball there is rule 10.3.C. "The plate umpire may rectify any situation in which the reversal of an umpire's decision or a delayed call by an umpire puts the batter-runner, runner or the defensive team in jeopardy. "

Certainly best to make the IFF call at the correct time, but if you don't, you still need to apply the rule. And if your delay in applying the rule put either team in jeopardy, you need to fix it.
 
Jun 22, 2008
3,502
63
Both The USA and The NSA don’t allow the umps to retroactively apply the Rule.
Cant say for sure on NSA, but you are completely wrong about USA, here is the rule clarification.


Rule 8, Section 2I Batter-Runner is out

Play:
R1 on 3B, R2 on 2B and R3 on 1B and one out. B5 hits, what appears to be, an infield fly that it is not called by the umpires. The ball was not caught and F5 picks up the ball and throws home for a force play with no tag being applied, and the runner is called out. After all play has ceased the defensive coach requests time to discuss the play with the umpires as they feel that the infield fly should have been called per ASA rules. After the umpires discuss the situation the plate umpire calls the batter-runner out on an infield fly and rules the runner that touched the plate safe for not being tagged. The offensive coach protests and asks if the umpires can legally call Infield fly after the fact?

Ruling: If after the umpires get together and agree this fly ball met the criteria of Rule 1, INFIELD FLY, and the umpire failed to make the correct call at the time, then Rule 9, Section 1A[1-4] allows the umpire to call “Infield Fly” when the opposing team brought this to the attention of the umpires. In regards to R1 at 3B, by the umpire not calling “Infield Fly” this put both teams in jeopardy. Rule 10, Section 3C allows for the umpire to rectify any situation in which a reversal of an umpire’s decision or delayed call places the offensive or defensive team in jeopardy. In the above case, the batter should be ruled out for Infield Fly and return R1 to 3B.
As to the question of whether the umpires can decide, after the fact, to call an Infield Fly or not, the following information should be noted:
 
Dec 15, 2018
238
43
CT
These rules threads can be like a trick candle...just when you think you have it blown out....up pops the wrong answer again. There should be a "CORRECT ANSWER" stamp / link, so when you click on the thread it just takes you straight to that answer, and a retro-active "DEBUNKED" stamp on the wrong ones.

I know, I know, some threads people can reasonably disagree on (some aspects) - but some...
 
Nov 22, 2019
194
43
Minnesota, USA
These rules threads can be like a trick candle...just when you think you have it blown out....up pops the wrong answer again. There should be a "CORRECT ANSWER" stamp / link, so when you click on the thread it just takes you straight to that answer, and a retro-active "DEBUNKED" stamp on the wrong ones.

I know, I know, some threads people can reasonably disagree on (some aspects) - but some...
Really haven't seen a "Correct Answer" since the whole situation is up to the umpire's discretion at the time. Yes, the rule is active anytime the situation is set up to allow it but still isn't actually happening until an umpire makes the call. If they do retroactively enforce the rule and any runners besides the batter were put out because they didn't call it right away then they go back to their base.

This is not a difficult concept to understand, there are just too many umps commenting who are taking the rulebook as black and white which as we all know never happens. I am sure we have all seen a strike called a ball and a ball called a strike. Your opinion on it is irrelevant unless you're the umpire making the call.
 
May 29, 2015
1,989
113
These rules threads can be like a trick candle...just when you think you have it blown out....up pops the wrong answer again. There should be a "CORRECT ANSWER" stamp / link, so when you click on the thread it just takes you straight to that answer, and a retro-active "DEBUNKED" stamp on the wrong ones.

I know, I know, some threads people can reasonably disagree on (some aspects) - but some...
I think that is a great idea! That and "sticky" threads on common topics so we can quit kicking the same dead horses.
 

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