Sign Stealing and Cheating

[El Oso]

Organically, by players in the field, over time, watching the catcher and memorizing their signs as they relay them to the pitcher.

Not the proper word for this discussion because by definition, what the Astros did was "organic", but it was cheating, while a runner on 2nd base relaying what the pitch will be to the hitter is also "organic", but not considered cheating. The use of technology is one factor that can turn something from that which is allowed into something that is considered cheating.

 

[ThomasLock]

That's kind of a unique scenario. I assume they'd be asked to leave if they were undermining their own team (if that's the question, it's a little hard to tell exactly what you are asking).

A long time ago on a 10U relatively low-level travel team I coached a pitcher who we found out afterward was unwilling to strike out her friends on another team (she was a very good pitcher, almost unhittable at that level). We let it slide but not entirely surprisingly she stopped playing a few years later.

The scenario I was trying to create in my book is a high-stakes game where the girls are about to go against a team to position them for the Fast Pitch World Series. One of the girls on the team is giving the other team their signs and batter information ahead of the game. I was trying to figure out if the girl got caught if there would be disciplinary action against them at that level.

 

[ThomasLock]

Not the proper word for this discussion because by definition, what the Astros did was "organic", but it was cheating, while a runner on 2nd base relaying what the pitch will be to the hitter is also "organic", but not considered cheating.

Not the proper word for this discussion because by definition, what the Astros did was "organic", but it was cheating, while a runner on 2nd base relaying what the pitch will be to the hitter is also "organic", but not considered cheating.

Thank you, I'm a writer, not a softball coach, so I apologize in advance for improper word usage. I'm simply trying to find out rules applying to cheating. Here is my scenario - The scenario I was trying to create in my book is a high-stakes game where the girls are about to go against a team to position them for the Fast Pitch World Series. One of the girls on the team is giving the other team their signs and batter information ahead of the game. I was trying to figure out if the girl got caught if there would be disciplinary action against them at that level.

 

[El Oso]

Thank you, I'm a writer, not a softball coach, so I apologize in advance for improper word usage. I'm simply trying to find out rules applying to cheating. Here is my scenario - The scenario I was trying to create in my book is a high-stakes game where the girls are about to go against a team to position them for the Fast Pitch World Series. One of the girls on the team is giving the other team their signs and batter information ahead of the game. I was trying to figure out if the girl got caught if there would be disciplinary action against them at that level.

No official discipline from a formal organization if that is what you are asking. Travel softball isn't that formal. There is no "governing body" that sets rules like that. But it would be considered cheating by everyone who coaches and plays. Well, except for a few coaches that I know.

 

[ThomasLock]

No official discipline from a formal organization if that is what you are asking. Travel softball isn't that formal. There is no "governing body" that sets rules like that. But it would be considered cheating by everyone who coaches and plays. Well, except for a few coaches that I know.

Thank you so much! That was the answer I was looking for. Very helpful!

 

[Dabears17]

Looks like there is a rule against stealing signs in the Little League Softball.

Hey, Blue! - Protesting Unsportsmanlike Conduct

This month, we will explain and outline an umpire’s parameters to rule on the unsportsmanlike conduct of stealing signs that results in the disqualification of a player, coach, manager, or substitute. The situation described below is contingent on the home plate umpire discussing the penalty for...

www.littleleague.org

 

[ThomasLock]

Looks like there is a rule against stealing signs in the Little League Softball.

Hey, Blue! - Protesting Unsportsmanlike Conduct

This month, we will explain and outline an umpire’s parameters to rule on the unsportsmanlike conduct of stealing signs that results in the disqualification of a player, coach, manager, or substitute. The situation described below is contingent on the home plate umpire discussing the penalty for...

www.littleleague.org

Wonderful! Great find, thank you so much!!!

 

[sluggers]

Hi everyone, I'm doing research for a children's book, so please forgive my novice questions.
If sign stealing between a catcher and pitcher can be done organically, then why is it considered cheating? Or is it considered cheating? I know the Houston Astros were penalized heavily for this and fined.

What happens to a teammate if she is caught giving the teams signs to a player on another team?

Thank you so much,
Thomas Lockhaven

IN CHILDREN SPORTS:

If kids do it *BY THEMSELVES*, it is fine. However, kids rarely do it...they don't have the attention span.

What "really" happens? A 40YOA coach steals signs from a 12YOA girl.

And then there is the problem of "so what"? Up until pitchers are around 16YOA, the pitchers cannot consistently throw any pitch. So, yes, the sign says "inside drop ball" but 50% of the time the pitcher will throw a "high fastball".

IN PRO SPORTS

There are specific rules prohibiting using electronic devices to steal signs.

 

[ThomasLock]

IN CHILDREN SPORTS:

If kids do it *BY THEMSELVES*, it is fine. However, kids rarely do it...they don't have the attention span.

What "really" happens? A 40YOA coach steals signs from a 12YOA girl.

And then there is the problem of "so what"? Up until pitchers are around 16YOA, the pitchers cannot consistently throw any pitch. So, yes, the sign says "inside drop ball" but 50% of the time the pitcher will throw a "high fastball".

IN PRO SPORTS

There are specific rules prohibiting using electronic devices to steal signs.

Thank you so much. I was trying to figure out if there was an elite level where the girls would be going into a high-stakes game, such as the Fast Pitch World Series, or older teens where they may be playing at a level where they might be scoped out by a college scout. I wasn't sure if this level of softball existed. I was trying to figure out if at a (high-level) if the girl got caught if there would be disciplinary action against them at that level. I know I've seen fast pitch on television (teen players) and I was wondering at this level, if someone were to give another team the signs, what would happen. Is the person punished? Is the entire team punished? I'm trying to figure out what direction to go with my book.

Thank you so much! I'm gaining a lot of valuable insight from this group.

In kindness
Thomas

 

[sluggers]

Thank you so much. I was trying to figure out if there was an elite level where the girls would be going into a high-stakes game, such as the Fast Pitch World Series, or older teens where they may be playing at a level where they might be scoped out by a college scout. I wasn't sure if this level of softball existed. I was trying to figure out if at a (high-level) if the girl got caught if there would be disciplinary action against them at that level. I know I've seen fast pitch on television (teen players) and I was wondering at this level, if someone were to give another team the signs, what would happen. Is the person punished? Is the entire team punished? I'm trying to figure out what direction to go with my book.

Thank you so much! I'm gaining a lot of valuable insight from this group.

In kindness
Thomas

The top level of softball right now is Premier Girls Softball http://www.premiergirlsfastpitch.com. In the past, it was ASA softball.

The PGF is extremely competitive at all age levels. Lots of college coaches show up for 16U and 18U games.

If a player were to give the signs to the other team, she would be kicked off the team. There is a remote chance she would be banned from playing PGF softball again.