Separation

[Work=wins]

There has been talk on here from different posters about creating power with the legs and the hips via rotation or through leg drive. There have been many pros who talk about not rotating or staying straight as long possible when they swing. Weird? Been saying this for awhile now.

Can a hitter create lots of power counter rotating their upper and then rotating their hips open? Sure quite a bit. Is it what the best do? Is that the most efficient way to create power w/o sacrificing time or adjustability?

The goal is not to create a huge stretch so that you can drag it on around and eventually snap the bat through. The goal is close the gaps of the counter rotation and rotation as quick as possible so the barrel can get to the ball quicker. Rotating the hips fully and driving the legs through is not how to do it. Hip rotation is a stretch reflex early and stops very shortly afterward. Trying to stop the hips from rotating will actually rotate you faster.

 

[clemenslee1]

There has been talk on here from different posters about creating power with the legs and the hips via rotation or through leg drive. There have been many pros who talk about not rotating or staying straight as long possible when they swing. Weird? Been saying this for awhile now.

Can a hitter create lots of power counter rotating their upper and then rotating their hips open? Sure quite a bit. Is it what the best do? Is that the most efficient way to create power w/o sacrificing time or adjustability?

The goal is not to create a huge stretch so that you can drag it on around and eventually snap the bat through. The goal is close the gaps of the counter rotation and rotation as quick as possible so the barrel can get to the ball quicker. Rotating the hips fully and driving the legs through is not how to do it. Hip rotation is a stretch reflex early and stops very shortly afterward. Trying to stop the hips from rotating will actually rotate you faster.

Like when you see scissoring action in hitters?

 

[2br02b]

Any drills to help a batter "feel" the obliques working?

 

[_MIA_]

From that video, what he is saying give explanation to the question of why hitters just don't start in their setup from the "launch position" and the reason is in the way muscles work (e.g.muscles are rate-dependent materials). The contractile force a stretched muscle can produce goes down the longer it is held in that position. Nice vid @Work=wins

 

[Work=wins]

Like when you see scissoring action in hitters?

That is one way. It’s a reaction to staying anchored and resisting hip turn .

 

[Work=wins]

Any drills to help a batter "feel" the obliques working?

Take moderate dry swings while keeping the hips Knees and feet facing towards the plate. Think of the lower body as a tree trunk that can be pulled from the ground. If you can’t feel it, exaggerate the load portion of the sequence.

Edit: can’t *

 

[Bobby Shirer]

There has been talk on here from different posters about creating power with the legs and the hips via rotation or through leg drive. There have been many pros who talk about not rotating or staying straight as long possible when they swing. Weird? Been saying this for awhile now.

Can a hitter create lots of power counter rotating their upper and then rotating their hips open? Sure quite a bit. Is it what the best do? Is that the most efficient way to create power w/o sacrificing time or adjustability?

The goal is not to create a huge stretch so that you can drag it on around and eventually snap the bat through. The goal is close the gaps of the counter rotation and rotation as quick as possible so the barrel can get to the ball quicker. Rotating the hips fully and driving the legs through is not how to do it. Hip rotation is a stretch reflex early and stops very shortly afterward. Trying to stop the hips from rotating will actually rotate you faster.

That's a poor interpretation of what he said and might lead some to believe that they shouldn't turn their pelvis.
Rotating the hips and then further rotating them just adds to the stretch.
I don't think anyone is promoting the shoulders not catching up to the pelvis during the swing, but for your interpretation it sounds like you're saying that pelvis turn is bad and should be limited or not allowed.
The scissor thing is merely a different way of allowing the back leg to become unweighted. It limits the overall turn and probably doesn't work well on inside pitches without some other compensation, one of which would be to hasten the shoulder turn to the point where is might get ahead of the pelvis turn.

 

[Work=wins]

That's a poor interpretation of what he said and might lead some to believe that they shouldn't turn their pelvis.
Rotating the hips and then further rotating them just adds to the stretch.
I don't think anyone is promoting the shoulders not catching up to the pelvis during the swing, but for your interpretation it sounds like you're saying that pelvis turn is bad and should be limited or not allowed.
The scissor thing is merely a different way of allowing the back leg to become unweighted. It limits the overall turn and probably doesn't work well on inside pitches without some other compensation, one of which would be to hasten the shoulder turn to the point where is might get ahead of the pelvis turn.

I said turning the pelvis should be a stretch reflex. It’s shouldn’t be something to achieve. Some gotta take more slack out than others(more pelvis turn). The more you turn the pelvis the farther the trunk and shoulders gotta go to catch up. Imagine a player that is rotating the hips freely? They never catch up and are left with a spin swing and no direction.

If One is trying to create power w hip/shoulder separation during the stride, that leads to longer swings. Stretch it the other way to create short, efficient power. Meaning let the shoulders/hands separate forward while the hips stay back. The release. Doesn’t matter pitch location the hips shouldn’t get to 90 degrees. Not saying they don’t sometimes. They just gotta stop to deliver the trunk and head. If your forcing hip rotation your anchors won’t hold and you will not deliver the barrel w control and precision.

Nobody is saying don’t get the slack out.

 

[Bobby Shirer]

I said turning the pelvis should be a stretch reflex. It’s shouldn’t be something to achieve. Some gotta take more slack out than others(more pelvis turn). The more you turn the pelvis the farther the trunk and shoulders gotta go to catch up. Imagine a player that is rotating the hips freely? They never catch up and are left with a spin swing and no direction.

If One is trying to create power w hip/shoulder separation during the stride, that leads to longer swings. Stretch it the other way to create short, efficient power. Meaning let the shoulders/hands separate forward while the hips stay back. The release. Doesn’t matter pitch location the hips shouldn’t get to 90 degrees. Not saying they don’t sometimes. They just gotta stop to deliver the trunk and head. If your forcing hip rotation your anchors won’t hold and you will not deliver the barrel w control and precision.

Nobody is saying don’t get the slack out.

Wouldn't separating the trunk and shoulders forward and leaving the hips back be a swing with no preswing stretch? Also it would mean the shoulder pulls out Iimiting the length of the swing path in the zone.
Finally, don't assume a longer swing is a bad thing. I could start with my hands and bat at the contact point and have a very short swing....aka bunt. That added swing length gives valuable time to create power, more length =more power.

 

[Work=wins]

Wouldn't separating the trunk and shoulders forward and leaving the hips back be a swing with no preswing stretch? Also it would mean the shoulder pulls out Iimiting the length of the swing path in the zone.
Finally, don't assume a longer swing is a bad thing. I could start with my hands and bat at the contact point and have a very short swing....aka bunt. That added swing length gives valuable time to create power, more length =more power.

No need to get to an extreme to justify a longer swing. Longer swings happen all the time. Especially when a pro is trying to adjust a lesser speed pitch. I’ve found using separation as an adjuster is a very good option. But it’s not the norm.

If a fast pitch player Of decent size and age can’t put a ball over the fence w these bats nowadays. Something else is probably wrong. Their Separation doesn’t need to get larger. Their energy transfer probably lacks imo. Probably a few leaks etc.


The shoulders and hands getting ahead of the hips has nothing to do w pre stretch.