Runner on 3b and batter walks

[sluggers]

Catcher quick glance at runner on 3rd...
If no pick play,
Fire back to the pitcher immediatly.

*Pitcher having the ball is shortest throw to any base.
(Or to middle of base path with an infielder cutting off throw)

Communicate!!

Great!

But, won't the girls need to use their Ovaltine Secret Decoder Wristband (TM) in order to know what to do?

 

[radness]

But, won't the girls need to use their Ovaltine Secret Decoder Wristband (TM) in order to know what to do?

Heard USSSA wouldnt allow that...

 

[Primetime17]

As a hypothetical situation, you would only get one out. When you call LBR it is an immediate dead ball and if multiple runners were in a LBR it would be the umpire's judgment which runner was the first violator and was out.

Hopefully just a hypothetical - it all sounds very bush league. I wouldn't do it as a coach.

Just curious how is that Bush league. Just like those with the pitcher trying to pick a runner off second and they all pretend the ball went into outfield and runner goes for third and ragged out by pitcher. Isn’t that the same and is that Bush league. Just curious

 

[marriard]

Just curious how is that Bush league. Just like those with the pitcher trying to pick a runner off second and they all pretend the ball went into outfield and runner goes for third and ragged out by pitcher. Isn’t that the same and is that Bush league. Just curious

Yep, that is bush league as well.

 

[Ken Krause]

Here's another thought. What are your chances that the runner you stop at first base won't steal second on the very first pitch? Is your team prepared to hold that runner and the runner at third? IOW, if the runner on first takes off for second on the first pitch can you either throw her out or cut the throw and throw out the runner on third trying to come home?

If the answer to all the questions about your team's level of play isn't "yes," don't worry too much about the runner taking off for second on a walk. She'll be there on the next pitch anyway. Yes, it's annoying and insulting but so is a lot of stuff.

Depending on where you are in the lineup, however, maybe you can intentionally walk the next hitter, creating a bases loaded situation, and then try to get that runner on third as a force play. Or maybe even a double play with a throw to first. With zero outs at the start you're no worse off than you were before, only you now have two outs. With one out already, you're out of the inning instead of potentially throwing the ball all over the place and allowing two runners to score.

 

[The Man In Blue]

So involves this scenario. Runner on 3b. Girl walks. Then this is a play I have in my head so here goes

ball 4. Batter runs to first. Third baseman and secondbaseman run to the mound. The pitcher sneakily gives one of the girls the ball. Then the third baseman runs towards the runner at third causing her to move back and forth. The second baseman runs towards the batter who is rounding first and heading to second. Chaos on field as both fielders pretend to have the ball and fake a throw as they run to runner. The runners will probably hesitate and go back n Forth undecided what todo. Would they be out considering they have to go one way or the other. And before you ask. Yes. The pitcher was standing on the mound with the ball in her glove the whole time not making a move but holding her glove down
Sounds like it might work once but is that too childish if it’s legal. Just like a hidden ball trick. We would notify ump before game in case the situation comes about during play

First, I don’t get paid enough to deal with ... stuff ... like that. Do not expect me to be happy with you if I am having a bad day.

Second, a fake tag is obstruction.

Third, IN MY OPINION (some may disagree), I would consider the pitcher faking a handoff for F4 or F6 to fake a play the same as the pitcher making a play, which negates LBR. Edit: Whoops ... in USA Softball it does NOT need to be the pitcher making/faking a play. LBR is off in your scenario. Edit-edit: NFHS says “any action” by the pitcher which is “intended to cause a reaction” ... so LBR is off. Looks like USSSA is the only place to try these shenanigans.

Fourth, judgment call on my part and I am sure some will disagree with me, but catch me on the wrong day and I’m calling it unsporting behavior because you are trying to find a loophole (the pitcher technically did not make the play).

 

[The Man In Blue]

Throwing the ball to first base never activates the lookback rule, so the runner on 3rd can do whatever they want and now the ball is 80+ feet away rather than about 40'. Not to mention, if I were coaching and a team threw the ball to first base it would not stop my batter/runner from attempting to take 2nd base. I would simply have my batter/runner run straight through first base toward right field, by rule they are allowed to do so without liability to be put out, and then simply make a wide turn out into right field toward 2nd base. Now the defense has to decide to chase after the runner and risk letting the run score or just let the runner take 2nd.

As for the hidden ball trick posted above, if the ball is with the pitcher in the circle when the batter/runner touches first base the lookback rule is in effect. The runner at 3rd would have to advance or return to 3rd base immediately so there would be no dancing around off of 3rd base.

Be careful in USSSA ...

A batter-runner who overruns first and does not without delay attempt to advance to second is committed to return to first and stop.

 

[fanboi22]

As a hypothetical situation, you would only get one out. When you call LBR it is an immediate dead ball and if multiple runners were in a LBR it would be the umpire's judgment which runner was the first violator and was out.

Hopefully just a hypothetical - it all sounds very bush league. I wouldn't do it as a coach.

Highlighted is what is curious to me. We had a situation where a very fast team had runner on 3, walked the batter and the when the walked batter passed 1st base (pitcher had ball in circle) they just side stepped slowly just baiting the pitcher to do something. If there is no requirement for a pitcher to actually 'look' at a runner, and if the ump calls LBR, then if it is a dead ball as stated above, the runners would have to go back to their 3rd and 1st base, correct? Can the LBR be called if both runners are advancing...slowly? What if one and not the other? Better yet, what initiates an ump to call LBR? Movement or no movement? Once the pitcher tries to make a play i think all bets are off, correct?

 

[tim_s]

the one not advancing/making an immediate decision is out

i don't believe there is a speed function of the rule......but might an umpire interpret a slow side step as a hesitation/direction change?

 

[marriard]

Highlighted is what is curious to me. We had a situation where a very fast team had runner on 3, walked the batter and the when the walked batter passed 1st base (pitcher had ball in circle) they just side stepped slowly just baiting the pitcher to do something. If there is no requirement for a pitcher to actually 'look' at a runner, and if the ump calls LBR, then if it is a dead ball as stated above, the runners would have to go back to their 3rd and 1st base, correct? Can the LBR be called if both runners are advancing...slowly? What if one and not the other? Better yet, what initiates an ump to call LBR? Movement or no movement? Once the pitcher tries to make a play i think all bets are off, correct?

• If you call LBR someone is out - any other runner would return to previously legally touched base.
• Yes, the moment the pitcher looks to make a play in any way, LBR is off and base runners are free to do what they like...
• There is no speed requirement, just a direction. So as long as they remain in motion - no matter what speed - then THAT runner is OK.
  
  Assuming 'no play', you call a LBR on NO MOVEMENT (i.e. they stopped and didn't make in the umpire's judgment an immediate change of direction) or if they make any SECOND CHANGE OF DIRECTION