rotational vs. combinational approach

[Wellphyt]

The acronym PCR is not a technique but rather a measurement. It is also not a scam as Wellphyt suggest.

The problem with these message boards is that the written word can be misinterpreted. The reason I suggested that 2012 ignore the term PCR is because I do not consider PCR a technique. It's just an acronym that can apply to any number of movements in the MLB swing. I thought I was taking Englishbey's side on this

I understand that PCR is a technique to some, but since I don't know, or care about the history of the term PCR, I just totally discount it when evaluating Englishbey. I understand what it stands for and how it's applied in the MLB swing and that's all I really care about. So, the term PCR does not mean the same to me as it does to someone like Tom who knows the entire history.

I also don't think it's a scam. It's just an acronym that represents a methodology. That's all I really think it is. I've also been in business long enough to know the importance of developing catchy phrases and terminology to seperate a business from it's competitors. I don't consider that a scam. I consider it smart business.

Epstein for instance uses "Firing Line Experience" to describe the fact that he played in the MLs. I think it's kind of corny, but he obviously thinks it's catchy.

Sorry my post struck a nerve. That wasn't my intent.

 

[Cannonball]

The problem with these message boards is that the written word can be misinterpreted. The reason I suggested that 2012 ignore the term PCR is because I do not consider PCR a technique. It's just an acronym that can apply to any number of movements in the MLB swing. I thought I was taking Englishbey's side on this

I understand that PCR is a technique to some, but since I don't know, or care about the history of the term PCR, I just totally discount it when evaluating Englishbey. I understand what it stands for and how it's applied in the MLB swing and that's all I really care about. So, the term PCR does not mean the same to me as it does to someone like Tom who knows the entire history.

I also don't think it's a scam. It's just an acronym that represents a methodology. That's all I really think it is. I've also been in business long enough to know the inportance of developing catchy phrases and terminology to seperate a business from it's competitors. I don't consider that a scam. I consider it smart business.

Epstein for instance uses "Firing Line Experience" to describe the fact that he played in the MLs. I think it's kind of corny, but he obviously thinks it's catchy.

Sorry my post struck a nerve. That wasn't my intent.

It didn't stike a nerve. Instead, I have grown weary of all of these sites turning into a us versus them. Here is a young lady that has asked questions and so, in answering her initial question, I did my best to stear her toward several places while saying what I do with my child. Your quoted post above is TOP NOTCH! I thank you for that.

In the journey we've all been on, we've all had success and setbacks. Most of the posters involved here know what it takes to be successful and yet, we've taken different roads. I hope all find the right path for themselves.

 

[tom.guerry]

cannonball -

My opinion is that PCRW is a technique in spite of the fact that it's creator, Nyman thinks of it as a blueprint/specification.

The problem is that part of the PCRW specification (the part that is most important in determining swing pattern, the way connection is made between body and arms) is that you tuen the bat in the shoulder plane while turning the shoulders as if there is a rod through both shoulders.

This requirement prevents the shouldet tilt and spatially early on the fly adjustment as described by epstein which is an essential part of the MLB pattern.

The Nyman blueprint, if followed, forces this 1 plane pattern and prevents the MLB pattern.

 

[Cannonball]

Tom, with all due respect and I know you've been at this a long time, did you read what you typed? The inventor of the philosophy says it's one thing and you suggest that he is wrong in asserting what he identified in the very definition of his thoughts on the swing. (Conceptionally) We both should agree that Posture, Rotation, and Connection were around even in Babe Ruth's time.

Tom, what I've often wondered was that if I put up video of 4 young ladies could anyone pick out my girl based upon her swing?

Back to the subject, I think that the phrases rotational and linear are no longer in vogue. I think that people are more rotational in their thoughts but most now admit to the linear elements in these swings. I also think that over time most of the hitters have had several influences by the time they reach high school. It would not be accurate, in my opinion, for anyone to say that this is a _____________ swing.

 

[tom.guerry]

cannonball -

The inventor says the shoulders turn, not tilt, and bend at waist is how you adjust.

Neither of these requirments is part of the MLB swing pattern.

yes, all swings have PCR.

Almost all swingers have arms and legs and a torso,too, but this is not helpful info as it is so generalized.

Not all have whip.

even if they have whip, it is spatially early in the MLB swing.

It DOES help to know there are absolutes to the MLB pattern as described by many including Epstein/Lau/Slaught, etc.

 

[pgbasell]

This PCR is a blueprint stuff is really funny.

Every swing exhibits P,C and R.....good swings.....and bad swings.

To distinquish between the two.....what is good and what is bad.....there is a teaching system.

Therefore there is nothing wrong with saying the blueprint is also the name of the hitting instruction. Blueprint.....instruction.....they are the same. There is a definite teaching system to teaching PCR. There are absolutes.....like swing in the rotational path of the shoulders. Tilt the posture for pitch adjustment. Rotate around the front hip joint. The hands are just along for the ride.

When posters not involved with PCR....call it PCR.....they are speaking of the teaching system....not the blueprint. If you have a name for the teaching system I'll gladly use that name. Until then it's called PCR. Because when we say PCR we aren't speaking of the blueprint....we're speaking of the teaching system behind the blueprint.

If you are bothered by that.....who cares.

If you are interested in progressing into a discussion of the PCR teaching system, we're all ready.

 

[Cannonball]

Stop cracking me up. Instruction and a measurement are far different. For example, one might have a way of explaining the role of a concept but then have two or three ways of instruction to enable a player to model a swing that might be similar in measurement. Since it is obvious that you are posting under a different name than at other sites, why the change? In any regard, there isn't one "teaching system" as you suggest. There are multiple options in drill work to fit what makes sense to the player and coach. This would not be unlike some of the stuff Candrea and Enquist now show on the RVP software. They both have drills with similar names and yet, do different demonstrations.

 

[tom.guerry]

Candrea and Enquist are describing the MLB pattern after Slaught which is quite different from what they call the "gate swing" which is like PCR.

The MLB pattern starts with back arm action similar to the overhand throw, so they suggest "if you can throw, you can hit".

The PCR/gate swing is a different pattern from the MLB swing.

 

[Mark H]

Slaught's not bad except for that rock skipping cue. Drills are shaky at best but the exposition isn't too bad though the demonstrations need tightening up.

Anyone know what the heck a pcr gate swing is?

 

[Slapper23]

Mark, I believe Tom is referring to the swing system taught by Steve Englishbey...to answer your question. Rotation around the front leg/hip like a gate swinging around the gate post - such as that taught by Englishbey. I used to believe that to, but then moved on.

Mark, can you explain your thoughts on momentum creation and transfer? I think that would be helpful to all.

Mike