Pure barrels or cut!

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May 21, 2018
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Like I said it can be misleading.. I agree 100%. I can see how those in attendance can get the wrong idea. It doesn't take 100 hours(I know it's arbitrary number) for somebody to recognize a trend here, what most of the great hitters say, and try to understand what they mean. I mean if your students didn't understand a difficult concept in your lecture wouldn't you expect them to ask or research to find answer or just blow you off as old fool who doesn't have a clue. Because that's what a lot posters on this site do, Pujois, Trout, Arod, Yelich, etc. they don't have a clue, they don't know what they are talking about

The problem I have with this, is that they say "swing down to the ball". They don't say "swing down to ball with proper sequence and posture from a FYB leveraged position". This all gets added by other people.

So, if I'm to listen to the great hitters I would have to teach "swing down to the ball" as LC very clearly demonstrates, because that she actually said. It's been a bit since I've watched any Albert clips, but I think he says the same.

EDIT: I'm not saying the added content is wrong. In fact I think it's probably 90% correct, but there is a lot of interpreting going on of what the pros actually say and mean.
 
May 12, 2016
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Well a classroom setting is different since their access to me is a lot more than LC or Pujols so yes I would expect them to ask questions. A lot of times people think they understand something but only later find out that they don't. In a classroom setting that is what office hours, etc are for..I don't think LC or Pujols have office hours :LOL: However it is also my job, since I am getting paid, to try as hard as I can to make the presentation of the material as "fool proof" as possible. That isn't always possible of course. If LC and Pujols are only presenting a portion of the "material" and don't explain that, then they are doing others a disservice (in particular LC since she was getting paid to do that clinic...).
If the best hitters in the world say "down to" and I am interested in helping my DD be the best she can be.. then I am going to try to understand what they are talking about instead of discrediting them. I'm doing a disservice to my own DD if I didn't explore what they are saying.
 
Jun 8, 2016
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If the best hitters in the world say "down to" and I am interested in helping my DD be the best she can be.. then I am going to try to understand what they are talking about instead of discrediting them. I'm doing a disservice to my own DD if I didn't explore what they are saying.
lol.. I am discrediting their "teaching style" not the "down to". How many people at that clinic do you think actually were able to use what she said and produce a HL swing? Be honest...maybe 10%? You can blame the parents in the audience all you want, but at the end of the day the instructor is at least partially to blame for that.. If she had said what I am going to say today will require you to do some outside work in order to replicate a good swing she would have at least been honest but probably would not have been invited to give any more clinics. More than likely she was taught down to and then figured out the rest on her through hours of practice and trial and error and hence didn't understand what she was actually doing well enough in order to be able to explain it fully. Doesn't make her a bad person just a not so good teacher...
 
May 12, 2016
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The problem I have with this, is that they say "swing down to the ball". They don't say "swing down to ball with proper sequence and posture from a FYB leveraged position". This all gets added by other people.

So, if I'm to listen to the great hitters I would have to teach "swing down to the ball" as LC very clearly demonstrates, because that she actually said. It's been a bit since I've watched any Albert clips, but I think he says the same.

EDIT: I'm not saying the added content is wrong. In fact I think it's probably 90% correct, but there is a lot of interpreting going on of what the pros actually say and mean.
Does it? EF mentioned the Hanson Principle, can you not see good sequence and posture in a major league swing? I didn't make it up, it's obvious .. do you agree with that?

What get's added is the objective of TTB from go.. those jumping to the result, looking for a shortcut of getting the barrel on plane early in a swing.

Just my two cents, stop interpreting, pick up a bat, try to swing "down to" with great sequence and posture. See what happens.

I agree demos can be misleading.. not just baseball, all sports especially when isolating movements and not including the overall sequence

Edit: The point I am making here is a lot of people on here complain and discredit what the best in the game say, demo and practice. Many on here try to explain how "down to" is incorporated in a swing.. but instead of listening or trying it themselves they just talk about barrel path. You agree that barrel path is a result of upstream actions? Is it that much of a stretch to understand how down to with good sequence and posture leads to the barrel path we see in a major league swing?

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May 12, 2016
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lol.. I am discrediting their "teaching style" not the "down to". How many people at that clinic do you think actually were able to use what she said and produce a HL swing? Be honest...maybe 10%? You can blame the parents in the audience all you want, but at the end of the day the instructor is at least partially to blame for that.. If she had said what I am going to say today will require you to do some outside work in order to replicate a good swing she would have at been honest but would not have been invited to give any more clinics probably. More than likely she was taught down to and then figured out the rest on her through hours of practice and trial and error and hence didn't understand what she was actually doing well enough in order to be able to explain it fully.
:) I'm not blaming the audience pattar.. if we are just talking about that one clinic, how many times do I have to say it can be misleading?

I'm thinking she already had the correct body movements and altered her hand path. But yeah I understand what you mean, it took some dedication and work to get to that point.
 
Jun 8, 2016
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But yeah I understand what you mean, it took some dedication and work to get to that point.
Right..I am with you. Most everybody on this board is interested in learning the correct way of doing things to try and help their kid. Not everybody has the ability/time/etc to do that and so it is an instructor's job to give as much information as possible to make their presentation as complete as possible. This is more geared towards LC since the pros are not getting paid to instruct...She actually gives lessons here in OK..I would be interested in seeing what she does in those private lessons (but not interested enough to pay for one since she charges an arm and a leg.. :LOL: )
 

radness

Possibilities & Opportunities!
Dec 13, 2019
7,270
113
lol.. I am discrediting their "teaching style" not the "down to". How many people at that clinic do you think actually were able to use what she said and produce a HL swing? Be honest...maybe 10%? You can blame the parents in the audience all you want, but at the end of the day the instructor is at least partially to blame for that.. If she had said what I am going to say today will require you to do some outside work in order to replicate a good swing she would have at least been honest but probably would not have been invited to give any more clinics. More than likely she was taught down to and then figured out the rest on her through hours of practice and trial and error and hence didn't understand what she was actually doing well enough in order to be able to explain it fully. Doesn't make her a bad person just a not so good teacher...
Completely agree with this point of communicating clearly!

Sometimes people explaining things know what there trying to say, but never say it like Julray is able to explain their interpretation.

'down on the ball' is another irrelevant phrase as it can be misinterpreted so many ways.

For instance, most barrels start in the air above shoulder height.
Any barrel comming into swing zone around or otherwise is comming down.
Therefore everyone could say yes my bat comes down.
 
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May 21, 2018
567
93
Does it? EF mentioned the Hanson Principle, can you not see good sequence and posture in a major league swing? I didn't make it up, it's obvious .. do you agree with that?

What get's added is the objective of TTB from go.. those jumping to the result, looking for a shortcut of getting the barrel on plane early in a swing.

Just my two cents, stop interpreting, pick up a bat, try to swing "down to" with great sequence and posture. See what happens.

I agree demos can be misleading.. not just baseball, all sports especially when isolating movements and not including the overall sequence
Of course I see good posture and sequence in a major league swing. Especially when watching slow motion video. What I don't see, is anything about posture or sequence in any of the popular hitting demos. (I'm sure there are some out there, but the ones that get referenced on this site the most don't mention it...Pujols etc.) Hence, watch what they do, not necessarily what they say, or at least not just what they say.

I don't know what this has to do with TTB. Whether you're focused on TTB, or focusing on posture and sequence, you are still watching video to try and determine what it is they are actually doing. Otherwise you would be chopping down on the ball like they demonstrate.

I do think it's possible to use good sequence and posture and chop down on the ball. It's been taught like that for years.

I personally believe (and I think you might agree) that swinging around your spine with the proper tilt will result in a good barrel path. In golf they sometimes refer to it as replacing the front shoulder with the rear shoulder, but this doesn't happen automatically for a lot of people. It has to be taught to some/many. My natural tendency is to swing around rather than under, as is a lot of people's tendency, which is why so many people slice the ball.

At this point I might be arguing just for the sake of arguing. Character flaw I have.
 
Jul 16, 2013
4,659
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Pennsylvania
When someone makes a comment that is open for interpretation, the results are not always clear.

Ultimately there are two types of people in this world:
1) Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.
 

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