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Please share your input on my DD's motion(video)

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Sep 29, 2008
1,292
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Northeast Ohio
Could the pitchers and pitching coaches on the site look at this clip of my 14U daughter from this past weekend. Any thoughts on what looks good? What can be improved? ANy obvious problems? ANything to increase MPH? Thanks
 

halskinner

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May 7, 2008
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Could the pitchers and pitching coaches on the site look at this clip of my 14U daughter from this past weekend. Any thoughts on what looks good? What can be improved? ANy obvious problems? ANything to increase MPH? Thanks
Looks pretty good overall. Here is what stuck out to me;

Stride foot is landing at an exaggerated angle, try and get it closer to 45 degrees. The timing of the arm position at landing foot touchdown looks right on the money.

She brings her arm back quite a long way, before starting her forward motion.

Have her try ONLY bringing the arm back half that far, but, do it as quickly as she can possibly do it. That might not add ball speed, however, it can trim a half second or so off her overall time in her motions. THAT is enough to throw the hitters timing WAY off. Do that every now and then just to keep the batters from getting her timing down, once or twice a batter and remember do not set any patterns. I dislike patterns in pitching with great enthusiasm.

Now we have given her a tactic to use aganst the batters, Lets try for another easy one for her.

She is pitching as a double pump pitcher. Once she brings the ball back and then starts it forward, once that ball reaches her hip, she is throwing just like a leap and drag pitcher. She knows how to throw like a leap and drag pitcher, she just might not realize it. Have her practice throwing as a L&D pitcher also, use that now and then to throw their timing off also. If they are expecting the long wind up with the double pump and they get a very quick L&D instead, they will freeze waiting for the REST of the wind up!!!

Nothing says you can't use more than one pitching style on one batter.

Oh, Yeah, SHE WILL HAVE A BLAST MAKING THE HITTERS LOOK VERY UNTALENTED. :)

More pitching tactics
 
Sep 29, 2008
1,292
48
Northeast Ohio
Thank you for the input. That is a good observation about the exagerated foot angle. I felt like she might be opening her hips too early off the push but that may relate to that exagerated foot angle. I am going to have her focus on out towards the catcher first and then just a 45.

The arm is something that as she has tried to throw harder and push harder has kept getting higher. It worries me a bit because that is quite a move to try to time consistantly, even though I've seen others do it. It's like a golfer who is frustrated so they speed up their backswing. Whatever moves away from the target eventually has to reverse direction. We'll work on cutting that down a bit. I like that concept of cutting the arm movement and doing it quickly to throw off a batters timing. I will show that suggestion to her.

halskinner says,
She knows how to throw like a leap and drag pitcher, she just might not realize it. Have her practice throwing as a L&D pitcher also, use that now and then to throw their timing off also. If they are expecting the long wind up with the double pump and they get a very quick L&D instead, they will freeze waiting for the REST of the wind up!!!
Could you explain a bit more. Does that mean to just push straight out from the belly without the rocker and backward arm movement?

What do you think of the drag foot? Almost seems like a second plant for a moment when I look in slo-mo. OK as it is or up on the toe?

Thanks much.
 
May 22, 2008
351
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NW Pennsylvania
I just took my first video of the year od my DD & I also have a question. It looks to me like the gal in this clip is throwing exactly like mine. My question is this- isn't she releasing the ball from an almost open position??? shouldnt the hips be closing quicker & simultaneous with release? ( actually my DD might be even a bit more open) I would love to stick a clip of her on here but dont have a clue how to get it from mini dvd to this forum. Thanks Lane
 

sluggers

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May 26, 2008
5,921
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Dallas, Texas
First, the pitcher has a nice flow. Her arm looks relaxed and she is getting a nice whip action.

But, as always, there is room for improvement.



1. Her arm is slightly ahead of her body. At 12 o'clock, her left foot is down. It should still be off the ground. This means that she is losing some of the power from her legs.


2. She closes her shoulders, but leaves her hips open. So, her upper half of her body is fighting the lower half of the body. The shoulders and hips should stay open at release, and then close. You can see this by watching her left arm fly off to the side. She ends up pulling her glove sideways and down, rather than straight down, in order to hit her hip. Even then, she is hitting the outside of her left leg rather than the the inside of the left leg.

Also, note that her weight has already moved forward.

Take a look at the Jenny Finch video. Finch is an incredible athlete, but look specifically at the position of her foot when she is at 12'oclock, her head position during the pitch, and when she closes.

JC heir: The hips close at release, but after the arm passes the hips. *BUT*, you usually wait until the pitcher is older to start teaching closing the hips. There are at least two reasons. First, it is a mess if the pitcher starts closing too early. It is very difficult to break them of this very bad habit. Second, to throw a rise, the pitcher has to stay open and not close. Young pitchers can be easily confused if you try to teach them to stay open for a rise and then close for a fastball. Most don't have that much control of their bodies. It is much easier to teach them to stay open, teach the rise, and then later teach them to close the hips for a fastball.
 
Nov 6, 2008
71
0
Suggestions

She looks very good, but I would point out a couple of concerns: First of all it is difficult to tell for sure with the camera angle but it appears that her backswing takes her pitching arm not only back but also laterally across the mid-line of her back. Watch the 4 and 11 second marks of the video. Her arm appears to create a path across her body to the left side of her back rather than in a more linear arc. This needs to be addressed from a safety standpoint due to the obvious stress put on the shoulder joint, not to mention the functional effect that this backswing has on the arm circle going forward. Believe me that breaking this habit is very difficult and despite your best efforts she may not be able to swing her arm back without coming across her back. I would suggest taking the backswing out of her premotion and transitioning into coming out of the glove. See Hillhouse’s website or get his basic DVD for instruction in this windup.

Also, the high backswing she has is shifting her weight forward prematurely, resulting in her stride foot landing too soon in the arm circle. Elite pitchers like Finch can utilize the very high backswing and still remain balanced, someone your daughter’s age and level will have difficulty doing so.
 
Aug 6, 2008
43
0
First, I'm not a pitching coach, so I'll just relay what my daughter was told when she had a similar problem.

Notice how Holly is landing flat footed on her drag foot, and it actually stops with her weight on it, causing a slight replant. Then she shifts her weight slightly onto her stride foot and finishes her pitch. This is what I call the classic Midwest Replant, and it's pretty common. Notice how Finch never stops her drag foot moving forward AND notice how she is dragging the side of her foot. Leap and drag pitchers CAN'T replant because the toe or side of the foot is kept pointed down and they'd twist their ankle if they landed on it. My daughter started with a coach that taught very similar to what Cheri Kempf teaches. Try having her force herself to point her drag toe straight down at the ground during her motion.

Any time you can speed up the arm it's a good thing. Notice how Jennie's arm is at 9:00 (straight behind her) at toe touch. Holly is just slightly late in her arm swing, and I agree with the above posters that less of a swing back may help that. To help arm speed, my daughter did a drill standing in the "K" position, where she made three arm circles as fast as possible, then released the ball on the third revolution.

Here's my daughter at 14 on a foggy morning at a Disney tourney in Florida.

 
Sep 29, 2008
1,292
48
Northeast Ohio
Much thanks to everyone who has provided observations on Holly's pitching. There are a number of common suggestions we will talk about and look to modify. When we have some success at changing muscle memory I'll try to come back with a new video. In the meanwhile I'll appreciate any additional input. She's pretty good but she tells me she wants to be really good at her age level and she isn't there yet compared to some of the best I've seen at 14.
 

Amy in AZ.

Super Moderator
May 7, 2008
8,508
48
Tucson
What do you think of the drag foot? Almost seems like a second plant for a moment when I look in slo-mo. OK as it is or up on the toe?


Yes, I saw that immediately. If you take a series of still pictures of her, as quickly as you can, she will be able to see it.
 
Sep 29, 2008
1,292
48
Northeast Ohio
After looking at the clip in light of the comments here I have noticed the second plant too. We are going to the task of changing this starting tonight. I have no idea how this is going to effect her balance, timing etc. I think we are going to start without a ball and work on reducing the back swing and emphasize the arms instead in pushing out. Then without a ball we are going to work on up on the toe with a higher knee driving towards catcher and landing with a slightly reduced foot angle. That is a lot to fool with but we'd like to get as many proper mechanics in place now and see how far that takes her. Regarding that replant I know it is wrong so we are going to eliminate it but out of curiousity what benefits should we expect if we get up on the toe. Anyone have experience with making this correction?
 
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