Pitchers, Catchers, Wild Pitches & Passed Balls

[radness]

I confess that I have never played sports at an elite level, but I have to believe that every athlete at that level will berate themselves for missing a play they know they should be able to make regardless of whether it is an error or not.

And I have to believe that whatever it is that makes, say, a football receiver lay it all out to make an incredible catch knowing that the next thing is going to be a crushing hit from a defender is due to some passion for the game and winning and not the statistics book.

And I have to believe that 100% of athletes who take their sport seriously understand that there is only one statistic that matters.

Not certain that there is only one mindset to how people at any level View the outcome of plays or the scorebook.
Would not say that lower level or higher level players hold themselves to different standards.

Definitely know that how plays are viewed and applied in the scorebook can matter a heck of a lot to certain people.

In particular know wild pitches or pass balls are part of that conundrum.

 

[schwabach]

I don't really understand your point unless it is to say that you would like to see the definition of fielding errors changed.

 

[radness]

I don't really understand your point unless it is to say that you would like to see the definition of fielding errors changed.

No I'm not suggesting anything change.

Are you saying you don't recognize how in the mindset of people it makes a difference how things are scored and viewed?

Example~
For instance your daughter or player your team hits a ball to a defensive player. What you think is a rocket shot. The defensive player fumbles it. Batter is safe. The defensive player is given an error.
However
You think your daughter or player hit the ball so hard it should have been ruled a hit.

The difference effects statistics. And that matters a lot to some people.

 

[schwabach]

I'm saying that I don't think about it.

When I see a player commit a bad error or fail to make a play they probably can make 9 times out of 10, I just feel bad for the player.

 

[radness]

I'm saying that I don't think about it.

When I see a player commit a bad error or fail to make a play they probably can make 9 times out of 10, I just feel bad for the player.

Gotcha! It's not something you think about.

For some people though the judgment on the play makes a difference because it's judging them. And the way the application of the scorebook is can take away or add to that conundrum.

@schwabach Thanks for the chat on that!

 

[radness]

To have a discussion you have to have two opposing views...

Do not think that to have a discussion must have opposing views. Can have opposing views, but they don't have to be opposing. And all views can offer more perspective.

Here is some perspective to perspective. You have ongoing hitting posts about your daughter hitting.
My perspective is those threads are a discussion about hitting in softball.
Your daughter is just the player you use to get feedback about hitting.
You could use any hitter to look for perspective about hitting you just chose her. She is of interest to you. So that might matter more to you. However
The thread is not about your daughter tho, it is about hitting. I say that because anybody can gain insight/ perspective from hitting in those posts... they don't have to know your daughter.

In that same way used my perspective feedback as a player to show a mindset in softball.
The topic is not about me the topic is about softball.

 

[_MIA_]

Do not think that to have a discussion must have opposing views. Can have opposing views, but they don't have to be opposing. And all views can offer more perspective.

Here is some perspective to perspective. You have ongoing hitting posts about your daughter hitting.
My perspective is those threads are a discussion about hitting in softball.
Your daughter is just the player you use to get feedback about hitting.
You could use any hitter to look for perspective about hitting you just chose her. She is of interest to you. So that might matter more to you. However
The thread is not about your daughter tho, it is about hitting. I say that because anybody can gain insight/ perspective from hitting in those posts... they don't have to know your daughter.

In that same way used my perspective feedback as a player to show a mindset in softball.
The topic is not about me the topic is about softball.

Sure but there has to be something to discuss. In this case nobody is going to disagree with your take.. Whatever not a big deal

 

[radness]

Sure but there has to be something to discuss. In this case nobody is going to disagree with your take.. Whatever not a big deal

Hahaaa lol ! All good!

 

[erniekru]

An explanation of My Mind Set On the field.
Is not to say the way the score book is done is wrong. it is a perspective shared about being a softball player on the field.

We know that there are some pitches that are considered wild pitches and others considered passed balls.

Which means in the score book if the pitched ball bounces in front of the catcher it is considered a wild pitch.
And if it got by the catcher it would not be considered a passed ball.

For the purpose of being a defensive player.
It is my mindset that it does not matter if it is considered a wild pitch it is still my responsibility as a defensive player/catcher to play the ball and control it. Which additionally includes not letting Runners on base Steel the next base.
'Field and Fire'

(For this reason I set the expectation that I am not released from the possibility of an error because it is considered a wild pitch.)
*The ball is still in play and it is my job to control it.
If the ball gets by me just because it's in the dirt I consider that an error.
*Because I know that everybody else in their defensive positions have the responsibility of Fielding grounders.
Hold that responsibility to myself regardless if it came out of the pitcher's hand!

How did you come to the conclusion for the bolded above? A ball in the dirt is not automatically a wild pitch!! Again, just like with errors, the differentiator should be "reasonable effort".

in 8u, all balls in the dirt should be officially scored as wild pitch (but they're not, pitcher parent heads would explode!)
in 18u, a ball in the dirt MAY be scored a wild pitch depending on location and if the ball gets passed the catcher (ie, in front of the plate or in the correct river not a WP but a Passed Ball. In the batters box or oppo river, WP all day.

In regards to stolen bases, my opinions are if the catcher has anchored that runner at 1B for multiple at bats and the first pitch in the dirt she successfully gets to 2B, I'd say that the pitch enabled the runner to get to 2B.. To me that signals Wild Pitch. However, I've scored it many times as stolen base because it is a grey area. But just like hitting, there's situational pitching and that pitch in the dirt enabled the runner to advance, should not be put on the catcher IMO.

 

[LEsoftballdad]

Having a background in baseball, I consider a Wild Pitch to be one in which the catcher has no shot at stopping, catching, or blocking the ball to prevent a runner from advancing. Since MLB does not consider a passed ball to cause an earned run, that has to be on the catcher.

My daughters were the battery for the HS season the last two years, so when a PB/WP occurred, one of my girls was getting the blame.

I used the GC records to make my girls aware of their mistakes and try and fix them. We lost a game in the playoffs because of a passed ball on my daughter that allowed the runner on 2nd to go to 3rd. She then scored on a sacrifice fly on the next pitch. We discussed how important it was to prevent that runner from advancing in the hopes she won't do it again. For the record, it was a bad passed ball. She just whiffed at the ball.