New IR drill

[sluggers]

Why is the drill wrong? It's coming from a Tincher-trained coach that also pitched professionally for the Akron Racers.

So what? Whoever your PC is, Jenny Finch was a better pitcher. Jenny teaches HE, and Jenny is wrong.

My DD (11) sees a Tincher instructor. She’s done this drill at the last couple of lessons, but her instructor uses it to make her feel where her hips need to be at release.

But, that is not where her hips need to be. The kids in the videos are releasing with their hips completely closed--which is wrong. The hips should be at a roughly 45 degree angle relative to the pitching rubber.

Why would anyone do a drill where the entire body is in the wrong position?

@Hillhouse -- Bill, am I missing something?

 

[Bonesaw]

It does seem funny but I feel like this may be the underhand equivalent of this overhand drill from wasserman throwing.(throwing kneeling I mean here)



It does seem wrong at first glance but I feel like it isolates the "whip" like the drill above for overhand(getting external rotation). In this wrong footed stance the player has no choice but to use "IR" as they cant close to compensate, since they are already closed to the max. I might try this myself(i mean me not DD).

 

[NJSwampdragons]

Several weeks ago I was asked to help a new first year 12U team with 3 rec pitchers. I took a quick look at their motions, 2 were HE and 1 had a little IR. I started them on 'Lock it In' and moved on to sling shot (K position). Then I did something new because transitioning to full circle is always problematic. I asked them to stand in a 'release' stance, face forward, and make a mini arm circle pitch. By 'mini' I mean a small, tight ball circle, small in circumference. Focusing on a small circle forced them to keep their arm bent and this allowed them to transfer their IR from SS to full circle. They all 'got it'. Then we moved to a step and kept the small arm circle. We call them 'mini whip circles'. Typically I use 'lead the downswing with the arm/elbow flexed/bent' as a cue. Having them focus on a 'small' ball circle was much better, by putting their attention on the ball circle they naturally kept the arm flexed/bent.

A flexed/bent arm has never been my DD’s issue. This is full motion, and the throwing arm in these pics are consistent with how she always throws. You’d think a girl at this point in a pitch would probably finish with a pronated arm, but my DD often finds a way not to pronate her arm. So I’m trying to find something that gets her to finish.




She can do the drill with the feet the other way, although I like the reverse, seems like it forces brush.

 

[NJSwampdragons]

It does seem funny but I feel like this may be the underhand equivalent of this overhand drill from wasserman throwing.(throwing kneeling I mean here)



It does seem wrong at first glance but I feel like it isolates the "whip" like the drill above for overhand(getting external rotation). In this wrong footed stance the player has no choice but to use "IR" as they cant close to compensate, since they are already closed to the max. I might try this myself(i mean me not DD).

The drill from Instagram does reference Wasserman.

 

[SBmom8992]

This drill with the staggered stance is utilized by the Tincher instructor based out of Ohio who is partnered with Wasserman.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SBmom8992]

So what? Whoever your PC is, Jenny Finch was a better pitcher. Jenny teaches HE, and Jenny is wrong.


But, that is not where her hips need to be. The kids in the videos are releasing with their hips completely closed--which is wrong. The hips should be at a roughly 45 degree angle relative to the pitching rubber.

Why would anyone do a drill where the entire body is in the wrong position?

@Hillhouse -- Bill, am I missing something?

Those pics of Ueno and Abbott look more closed than 45 degrees to me. Ueno specifically points her stride toe directly to the catcher which will close the hips moreso than landing at 45.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ArmWhip]

A flexed/bent arm has never been my DD’s issue. This is full motion, and the throwing arm in these pics are consistent with how she always throws. You’d think a girl at this point in a pitch would probably finish with a pronated arm, but my DD often finds a way not to pronate her arm. So I’m trying to find something that gets her to finish.

View attachment 20414

View attachment 20422
She can do the drill with the feet the other way, although I like the reverse, seems like it forces brush.

Two things jump out at me. In these stills you can see that her right shoulder is higher than her left and it comes forward a little early. Her overall posture and spine angle are too 'forward'. It's easy to confuse throwing overhand with underhand. With overhand the shoulders lead the arm action, with underhand the shoulders have to stay back (open) to allow the arm to do it's thing. But the big thing I see is that her wrist is 'extended' or cocked back. Look at the 9 o'clock position, yes her hand is under the ball however that wrist angle/cock is a problem.

Overall the video looks better but when you slow it down that wrist cock is still there. If she were my student I would be asking her to stay back and open longer, let the arm whip and pull the shoulders closed. But most of all keep the wrist neutral and relaxed. If you have told her to keep her hand under the ball I'm thinking that she has interpreted that in such a way that she bends her wrist her back. Bending the wrist like that is not a natural position, I have to believe that she's doing it on purpose.

 

[NJSwampdragons]

Two things jump out at me. In these stills you can see that her right shoulder is higher than her left and it comes forward a little early. Her overall posture and spine angle are too 'forward'. It's easy to confuse throwing overhand with underhand. With overhand the shoulders lead the arm action, with underhand the shoulders have to stay back (open) to allow the arm to do it's thing. But the big thing I see is that her wrist is 'extended' or cocked back. Look at the 9 o'clock position, yes her hand is under the ball however that wrist angle/cock is a problem.

Overall the video looks better but when you slow it down that wrist cock is still there. If she were my student I would be asking her to stay back and open longer, let the arm whip and pull the shoulders closed. But most of all keep the wrist neutral and relaxed. If you have told her to keep her hand under the ball I'm thinking that she has interpreted that in such a way that she bends her wrist her back. Bending the wrist like that is not a natural position, I have to believe that she's doing it on purpose.

Thanks. I’ll try to get her to work on the wrist. She’s been instructed to stay back more, chin behind belly button.

 

[NJSwampdragons]

Two things jump out at me. In these stills you can see that her right shoulder is higher than her left and it comes forward a little early. Her overall posture and spine angle are too 'forward'. It's easy to confuse throwing overhand with underhand. With overhand the shoulders lead the arm action, with underhand the shoulders have to stay back (open) to allow the arm to do it's thing. But the big thing I see is that her wrist is 'extended' or cocked back. Look at the 9 o'clock position, yes her hand is under the ball however that wrist angle/cock is a problem.

Overall the video looks better but when you slow it down that wrist cock is still there. If she were my student I would be asking her to stay back and open longer, let the arm whip and pull the shoulders closed. But most of all keep the wrist neutral and relaxed. If you have told her to keep her hand under the ball I'm thinking that she has interpreted that in such a way that she bends her wrist her back. Bending the wrist like that is not a natural position, I have to believe that she's doing it on purpose.

I asked her, and she said she isn’t cocking her wrist on purpose, it just comes naturally. Some full motion video, you can see how she finishes. Some pitching coaches I have messaged with who aren’t on this board have said it seems like she is trying to force her arm to stop. She knows she isn’t supposed to lean, so maybe with that forward posture that’s her way of stopping herself from leaning. Maybe she’s tightening up at the end to avoid leaning.

 

[uncdrew]

I agree with the previous comments that I think she needs to switch your feet up when doing the drill. My DD goes to a Tincher instructor and it is similar to the drill we start each session with, but with switched feet from what your daughter has.

Yeah, what your daughter is doing isn't Tincher (as I know it). I've been doing Tincher for a few years, and we've never seen that drill. It may be what your instructor showed you, but my guess is that something's off a bit.

Ask your instructor if this is the 55 WIDE drill. If so, feet are wrong. We've never had a Tincher drill with feet the way you have them.

And yes, her upper body bends forward right at release. Gotta stay tall/stacked. My DD is taught to squeeze her back muscled together and her gluts to help achieve that.