Negative Move Or Not ?

[fivepotsogold]

OK ... I've been going over the "11 year swing analysis" thread inthis section. Along with comments from my "14 year old swing" thread in Practical.

Looking at videos posted of some of the best hitters around ..

some have a very significant "negative" move, some almost none ..

Why?
Which is better? (since they all seem to hit extremely well difficult to say one in better than the other)

More importantly:
How does a player know which (minimal, no, significant) is best for them?

 

[PAcoach]

I think a batter will find his her own style over a period of time. I usually will not mess with a batter that has minimal negative movement as long as she has success with it. However, we teach no negative movement. Especially if i'm working with younger or rec ball players. I feel the less movement the better.

 

[Ivy's Dad]

My 12 YOA DD has minimal to no negative move, and consistently (~ 0.600 hitting percentage) hits line drives to the outfield which land a few feet past the infield dirt. She considers herself a contact hitter. A typical inning for her would be hit single/walk to get to first base, steal second base, and possibly get to third base on wild pitch/passed ball.

The power hitters we see have more of a negative move. We discussed her using more of a negative move for more power, but we're afraid it will decrease her hitting percentage. We decided to have her continue with her current technique. I am also curious to hear what others have experienced regarding this.

 

[PEPPERS]

One thing I tell the kids is nothing extreme including the negative move, the negative move for us is the feeling of coming back about 2 inches, hand and front foot separate, and knee coils. It all happens in the blink of an eye, the swing, the ideal of minimizing movement to maximizing performance is beneficial for the hitter IMO.

 

[cshilt]

A "negative move" is nothing more than shifting the weight to the inside of the back foot. It can be subtle or pronounced, but the key point is to not stack the weight over the back foot. If you pause the video of a swing at the negative make sure that the knee is inside of the foot and the hip is inside of the knee.

 

[ifubuildit]

Negative move.

The negative move as it relates to the upper body is required to load the scapula complex of the back and shoulders. If you lift the back arm to parallel with the ground (Shoulder level) this enhances that feeling of loading the shoulders and you will feel the tension created by making that move. That tension stores elastic energy in the muscles. That energy is then released on the ball during the unloading process of the swing. Do not confuse as many do the negative move with counter rotating the shoulders. You will see kids do that more often than just taking the hands back a few inches.

You will generate better bat speed and power by performing the negative move through the release of that elastic energy.

Chris I have never considered weight shift to be a negative move but I can understand why you could come to that conclusion.

 

[cshilt]

Chris I have never considered weight shift to be a negative move but I can understand why you could come to that conclusion.

RVP terminology.

 

[Fastpitch Trainer]

Fivepotsgold-

Neither are better. I would suggest starting at a point where you feel like she is taking swings in rhythm with good timing. As she becomes consistent with this, you can tack on a little extra movement to the negative and positive move (within reason of course) and see what the results may be.

A contrast of 3 very good hitting teams would be Arizona, Georgia and Florida. Arizona kids are more of a lift the front toe, lift the front heel and go to the positive move. They do it slowly and deliberately to accumulate enough weight on the back side for an effective negative move without a lot of noticeable effort.

Florida kids tend to be more "efforted" during the positive move. There aren't a lot of Florida kids with a very noticeable negative move, but you see a lot of effort to get into the front leg (but not beyond it).

Georgia kids have the bigger negative move and some go with a leg kick. Their tempo as they begin to take the positive move tends to be a little slower than Florida kids, but they create more tension in the back side on the negative move.

What I'm saying is that, look at the results. 3 different approaches, but all 3 schools teach hitters to get to Toe Touch or Heel Plant with a lot of momentum to take into rotation. They all have different methods for doing this but all are obviously effective.

Arizona kids appear to be less effort on the negative and positive move than Florida or Georgia. Georgia tends to be more efforted on the negative move and Florida more efforted on the positive move.

Pick your poison they have all great hitting guys and they all rake. Just play around with it and see what works for you kid. Don't be afraid to go 0'for in a game while thinking about the big picture in hitting.

Good luck.

Mark Mulvany
Coach@fastpitchtrainer.com

 

[ifubuildit]

Chris

Yep. RVP will do that to you.

 

[tom.guerry]

Candrea/RVP type info on negative move at about 7 min mark:

Sportskool