Matsuda Slow Motion

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Nov 30, 2018
359
43
Marikina, Philippines
Does anyone smart have any input on "palm up" in relation to these top tier men pitchers? Many seem to be palm to third or even close to palm to ground(maybe palm to ground near third). They seem to ER very late in the downswing. When I throw I find this easier than being palm up at 9 oclock.

Here is another good example. Matsuda does it on many pitches as well in sluggers vidya.



Comparatively it seems most of the tip top women are much more palm up.


It is a rise-ball, and it should be palm to 3B. I might add that the single biggest issue I see with girls and rise-balls is rolling the back shoulder forward into release. That shoulder orientation must be parallel to home-2B, staying open if you are going to achieve an 11-5 or 12-6 spin. Weight shift back toward 2B, letting that back shoulder fall back directly at 2B as much as possible. I teach the girls to bring the thumb under the ball. The ball should come off the thumb knuckle, not off the tip of the thumb. Curveball, roll-over drop also somewhat, and the dirty word, "screw-ball" evolving into that direction. A peel drop is palm up, a fastball can be palm up especially for hello-elbow pitchers.

Hillhouse knows more than me, where is he?

A friend takes his DD to a men's fastpitch pitcher for lessons. It does seem like they throw different and teach it that way too. not the crop hop or leap, but just the arm/palm as you mention. I think it is, what is the natural position of the palm when the arm is coming up and around.

I had a college pitcher who couldn't throw a strike with her palm to plate. She had to rotate the palm toward 3rd coming over the top or she completely lost control.

At the same time our #1 pitcher threw 68 straight balls in fall practice before she threw a strike. I inherited these two so don't look at me! That later took some serious retraining but got back to normal by January.
 
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Aug 21, 2008
2,359
113
IF I had one Christmas wish this year, it would be for as many people as possible to get to see Folkard in person. You guys simply cannot imagine how fast he's throwing. He is a man among boys. Many of us have seen Clemens, or Randy Johnson pitch in a MLB game and thought "boy that looks fast". Now imagine that from a pitcher starting at 46 feet away vs. Baseball's 60' 6", then he jumps (literally 3-4 feet) closer before throwing something that moves more than you can imagine. I know, I know, I know.... the rise doesn't really go up. I still have a hard time with that, after having wiffed at his a few times. But aside from that, the sheer speed is amazing. And I've seen and/or been teammates with all of the people Quasi mentioned, Moore (not a flamethrower) to Meredith (who threw the hardest I ever saw before Folkard), Piecknik (close 2nd to Meredith), etc. etc. Folkard was unreal. And I use "was" because his last couple years have not been as dominant. There must be a "pick" going around that guys have on him where his velocity is still there but, knowing what's coming allows the hitters to adjust faster. He is still the best in the world, still the fastest, but the hitters have something on him that they are exploiting. His 88mph riseball isn't an automatic trip to the finals anymore.
 
May 15, 2008
1,913
113
Cape Cod Mass.
Curve spin is applied when the fingers go around the outside of the ball. This can be done in two ways, fingers/palm up or fingers pointing down with the palm facing in toward the leg (roll over). The roll over method generally has less spin and depending on how much IR is used the speed can vary significantly. When it's thrown harder it often has some drop spin, with less IR it can be a slow 'change up' curve.
 
Apr 20, 2018
4,581
113
SoCal
IF I had one Christmas wish this year, it would be for as many people as possible to get to see Folkard in person. You guys simply cannot imagine how fast he's throwing. He is a man among boys. Many of us have seen Clemens, or Randy Johnson pitch in a MLB game and thought "boy that looks fast". Now imagine that from a pitcher starting at 46 feet away vs. Baseball's 60' 6", then he jumps (literally 3-4 feet) closer before throwing something that moves more than you can imagine. I know, I know, I know.... the rise doesn't really go up. I still have a hard time with that, after having wiffed at his a few times. But aside from that, the sheer speed is amazing. And I've seen and/or been teammates with all of the people Quasi mentioned, Moore (not a flamethrower) to Meredith (who threw the hardest I ever saw before Folkard), Piecknik (close 2nd to Meredith), etc. etc. Folkard was unreal. And I use "was" because his last couple years have not been as dominant. There must be a "pick" going around that guys have on him where his velocity is still there but, knowing what's coming allows the hitters to adjust faster. He is still the best in the world, still the fastest, but the hitters have something on him that they are exploiting. His 88mph riseball isn't an automatic trip to the finals anymore.
but the hitters have something on him that they are exploiting.
Well pray tell. Care to elaborate on that 'something'?
 
Aug 21, 2008
2,359
113
but the hitters have something on him that they are exploiting.
Well pray tell. Care to elaborate on that 'something'?

I retired 4-5 years ago. When I was still on the NY Gremlins, Folkard's team was our ARCH RIVAL. Imagine Duke/UNC, Auburn/Alabama, Texas/Oklahoma, etc. that type of rivalry. And at the time, Adam was untouchable. Especially in some of the ballparks not orginally made for men's FP, where the lights are not ideal. Anyway, since my retirement, Adam isn't dominating the way he used to. I KNOW he didn't forget how to pitch, and even if he dropped to 85mph, he'd still be the fastest in the world by several MPH. But more runs are being scored off Adam now than 4 years ago, which means the hitters have figured something out. Since Australia (Adam's home country) is arch rivals with NZ, and Australia/NZ play each other a lot.... I'm guessing the NZ hitters got something. Now fastforward to the US club seasons, those NZ players spread out over 10 different teams and some might "share" what they have.

That said, NZ players are notoriously secretive so it's doubtful they would share their intel with Canadian players, or Americans or God forbid Australian players. But in all my years of experiences, this is the only LOGICAL explanation for why Adam isn't quite the same pitcher. Still the best in the world, just come up short the last 2 years (pre-Covid). His team finished 4th in the World the 2018 and 19. NY Gremlins (my former team) back to back world champs those years. Yes, I'm sure it's a coincidence!!!!! ha ha ha ha ha ha.
 
Jun 8, 2016
16,118
113
I retired 4-5 years ago. When I was still on the NY Gremlins, Folkard's team was our ARCH RIVAL. Imagine Duke/UNC, Auburn/Alabama, Texas/Oklahoma, etc. that type of rivalry. And at the time, Adam was untouchable. Especially in some of the ballparks not orginally made for men's FP, where the lights are not ideal. Anyway, since my retirement, Adam isn't dominating the way he used to. I KNOW he didn't forget how to pitch, and even if he dropped to 85mph, he'd still be the fastest in the world by several MPH. But more runs are being scored off Adam now than 4 years ago, which means the hitters have figured something out. Since Australia (Adam's home country) is arch rivals with NZ, and Australia/NZ play each other a lot.... I'm guessing the NZ hitters got something. Now fastforward to the US club seasons, those NZ players spread out over 10 different teams and some might "share" what they have.

That said, NZ players are notoriously secretive so it's doubtful they would share their intel with Canadian players, or Americans or God forbid Australian players. But in all my years of experiences, this is the only LOGICAL explanation for why Adam isn't quite the same pitcher. Still the best in the world, just come up short the last 2 years (pre-Covid). His team finished 4th in the World the 2018 and 19. NY Gremlins (my former team) back to back world champs those years. Yes, I'm sure it's a coincidence!!!!! ha ha ha ha ha ha.
You would think if he was tipping his pitches somebody on his own team would have picked up on it too and conveyed the message, no?
 
Jul 29, 2013
6,782
113
North Carolina
Bill, when I first got involved in fastpitch, I joined here in 2013, I soaked up and tried to learn everything about pitching I could shove into my brain!

You‘d be embarrassed if you knew all the research I did on you, bought 2....or 3 of your CD’s, your double ball, and watched everyone of your lessons on your site.

You always came across to me as a passive, calm, no nonsense guy who could pitch lights out, and better yet, teach pitching!

Then one day I ran across a video of Folkard, now mind you I have no idea what kind of guy he is, he could be a preacher for all I know? But the thing that struck me about him was his demeanor in the circle.....basically here it is A$$****, see what you can do with this, now go sit down!

I remember watching that first video of him probably 10 times in a row, then telling Anna to come check this guy out!
 
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Nov 30, 2018
359
43
Marikina, Philippines
what is a roll over curve?



Roll over wrist motion modified to follow through to the left thigh instead of the right thigh.
In the first photo the roll-over (drop-curve) would move down and in on that left-handed batter. Yippee!

By the way, Meghan Uher is her actual name. She threw 57 at age 16, 58-61 at 18, 61-63 in Division II softball.
 

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Nov 30, 2018
359
43
Marikina, Philippines
IF I had one Christmas wish this year, it would be for as many people as possible to get to see Folkard in person. You guys simply cannot imagine how fast he's throwing. He is a man among boys. Many of us have seen Clemens, or Randy Johnson pitch in a MLB game and thought "boy that looks fast". Now imagine that from a pitcher starting at 46 feet away vs. Baseball's 60' 6", then he jumps (literally 3-4 feet) closer before throwing something that moves more than you can imagine. I know, I know, I know.... the rise doesn't really go up. I still have a hard time with that, after having wiffed at his a few times. But aside from that, the sheer speed is amazing. And I've seen and/or been teammates with all of the people Quasi mentioned, Moore (not a flamethrower) to Meredith (who threw the hardest I ever saw before Folkard), Piecknik (close 2nd to Meredith), etc. etc. Folkard was unreal. And I use "was" because his last couple years have not been as dominant. There must be a "pick" going around that guys have on him where his velocity is still there but, knowing what's coming allows the hitters to adjust faster. He is still the best in the world, still the fastest, but the hitters have something on him that they are exploiting. His 88mph riseball isn't an automatic trip to the finals anymore.

Even at 75 if you observe and choose a pitch to swing at before you get anything in motion, you will have feet in cement and flip your bat at the ball in the catcher's mitt. You have to time the pitch, trigger, and make a quick decision in the process. IMHO that is why you see as many bad swings as you do, since observation time is so limited; and the game at that level is 10x harder than most imagine at the plate.
 

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