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Matsuda Slow Motion

Jun 8, 2016
7,973
113
And I admitted that. In fact I said it was a 1/72nd decrease in response time on the part of the batter IF . . . . .
the shorter distance (6 inches) was created by increased push-off creating equivalence of time equal to the original stride so as not to slow down the arm circle.
All things being equal meant equal velocity out of the hand. Also we were talking about the leaping in the men's game..is that really only 6 inches?
 
Feb 25, 2020
472
43
Me and my daughter figured out what Q just explained a few hours ago in the backyard. It was one of the "ladders" in our chutes and ladders experience I hope. Nice post(novel!?😀) Q.

With crow hopping the mechanics/timing are just very different its seems. They jump, land, and then throw.

I have watched this vid many times. There is also some good footage of Hillhouse not crowhopping on some of his DVD's.


There are a few mens pitchers who dont crow hop even though they can(I think.) Very interesting. My opinion is with the mens crow-hoppers it is just easier to see the "throw". (This guy doesnt crow hop and looks pretty darn good).

Anyways, I appreciate this thread thanks.
 
Last edited:
Nov 30, 2018
370
43
Marikina, Philippines
All things being equal meant equal velocity out of the hand. Also we were talking about the leaping in the men's game..is that really only 6 inches?

"I know nothing about softball pitching but if it is possible to have the proper mechanics and leap then the advantage would be you are releasing the ball closer to home plate..right?"
Well first the message wasn't only to you about your point but others who have brought this issue up. Secondly men generally crow-hop not leap by definition. I originally pitched with a step and a sling-shot, developing into the men's style. I might mention I was the #3 pitcher who pitched when our #1 and #2 got the flu. And knowing my capacity, both would usually show up in their pajamas to keep me off the rubber. I was a SS not a true pitcher.

The rule is stay in or in contact with the 16 foot circle line. There are supposed to be limits. So in theory the hips would be a minimum of about 36 feet from the plate at release. Can't go further, so then what?

My point to all coaches is, distance is not the end all be all. Usually it is over-emphasized in women's/girls, to the detriment of pitch speed. In men's, the point is irrelevant. Men pitch with their biceps (arms), women with their legs.
 
Nov 30, 2018
370
43
Marikina, Philippines
Me and my daughter figured out what Q just explained a few hours ago in the backyard. It was one of the "ladders" in our chutes and ladders experience I hope. Nice post(novel!?😀) Q.

With crow hopping the mechanics/timing are just very different its seems. They jump, land, and then throw.

I have watched this vid many times. There is also some good footage of Hillhouse not crowhopping on some of his DVD's.


There are a few mens pitchers who dont crow hop even though they can(I think.) Very interesting. My opinion is with the mens crow-hoppers it is just easier to see the "throw". (This guy doesnt crow hop and looks pretty darn good).

Anyways, I appreciate this thread thanks.
There were many golden era men's pitchers who did not crow-hop, especially from New Zealand. But some other great pitchers besides Michael White who were draggers were Kevin Herlihy NZ, Owen Walford NZ, Steve Schultz NZ, Ty Stofflet, and many others from every country. Michael Piechnik, Jimmy Moore, Peter Meredith did more of a "replant" than a big crow-hop.
 
Last edited:
Jun 8, 2016
7,973
113
My point to all coaches is, distance is not the end all be all. Usually it is over-emphasized in women's/girls, to the detriment of pitch speed. In men's, the point is irrelevant. Men pitch with their biceps (arms), women with their legs.
Gotcha..I know absolutely zero about softball pitching. Also with regards to this:
And knowing my capacity, both would usually show up in their pajamas to keep me off the rubber.
:LOL:
 
May 21, 2018
111
28
My point to all coaches is, distance is not the end all be all. Usually it is over-emphasized in women's/girls, to the detriment of pitch speed. In men's, the point is irrelevant. Men pitch with their biceps (arms), women with their legs.
Just out of curiosity, do you think this is pretty much a constant?

My DD uses very little leg drive at this point. I taught her early on to use more of a slow and go arm circle rather than focus on circle speed. My "thinking" was to try and mimic the mechanics of an overhand throw as much as possible. Her pitching coach teaches the same thing. He teaches more leg drive, but never works on speeding up the arm circle.

Not sure I explained that well.
 
Feb 25, 2020
472
43
Does anyone smart have any input on "palm up" in relation to these top tier men pitchers? Many seem to be palm to third or even close to palm to ground(maybe palm to ground near third). They seem to ER very late in the downswing. When I throw I find this easier than being palm up at 9 oclock.

Here is another good example. Matsuda does it on many pitches as well in sluggers vidya.


Comparatively it seems most of the tip top women are much more palm up.
 
Jul 8, 2020
37
8
A friend takes his DD to a men's fastpitch pitcher for lessons. It does seem like they throw different and teach it that way too. not the crop hop or leap, but just the arm/palm as you mention. I think it is, what is the natural position of the palm when the arm is coming up and around.
 
May 15, 2008
906
63
Cape Cod Mass.
A friend takes his DD to a men's fastpitch pitcher for lessons. It does seem like they throw different and teach it that way too. not the crop hop or leap, but just the arm/palm as you mention. I think it is, what is the natural position of the palm when the arm is coming up and around.
Palm position also relates to the pitch that is being thrown. If you are palm down in the downswing you can still IR but would be throwing a rollover drop or curve.
 
Nov 30, 2018
370
43
Marikina, Philippines
Just out of curiosity, do you think this is pretty much a constant?

My DD uses very little leg drive at this point. I taught her early on to use more of a slow and go arm circle rather than focus on circle speed. My "thinking" was to try and mimic the mechanics of an overhand throw as much as possible. Her pitching coach teaches the same thing. He teaches more leg drive, but never works on speeding up the arm circle.

Not sure I explained that well.
Power in the legs is not about a "Wright Brother's" flight to see how far down the beach you can go, but instead trying to see how fast you can get there. I am a little confused, but the constant for me is maximizing arm speed through speed in the legs. And the end result is legs that are still loaded with energy after release. It just doesn't fade when gravity requires a landing, and dissipate into a soft landing, but the legs come together with some force, enough force to maximize the arm speed. The hips are never raised in push-off. That requires more energy and time be expended in distance rather than cranking up the arm. Get on the front foot fast, and only as far as not to slow down the arm. You combine that with IR and you have some speed.

Just stepping or leaning has a tendency to force pitches high. I believe God gave batter's a pair of knees for a reason.
 
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