- Feb 3, 2016
- 502
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Love this thread. We decide after this season if DD is going to start the long process of switching to a slapper as she is just to darn fast not to make the commitment
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How many types of slap hits are there?
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- Mar 11, 2009
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The sooner the better! Good luck and let me know if you have any questions..
- Feb 15, 2016
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- 18
Good slappers are like artists. Some of them can do things that you haven't seen others do. Don't get caught up in what you call stuff. For example, people will say things like there is no such thing as a slap bunt well then they haven't seen the kid who can do it. Your slapper has arrived when she can read the defense and the only sign you need to give her is a bunt sign when you need a SAC. A good slapper is so fun to watch.
I count 2. Base hits and outs. I guess there are ROE's.
- Feb 3, 2016
- 502
- 43
My DD just started batting lefty about two weeks ago and is really do a great job. Once she can hit consistently we will work on the foot work aspect. So far so good. Looks like making her a right hander at 3 from a left hander is making the transition easier.
If she does it she needs to be 100% committed with the support of her coaches. Thank goodness my youngest DD's TB coach saw the potential in her as a slapper and let her come along slowly and didn't ask her to do too much right away. She stayed confident mostly because he did not lose faith in her through the initial struggles. There were many times she wanted to switch back over the the right side with two strikes and he would not let her.
On our HS team (reminder: We're not nearly at the level of many of your DDs, so keep that in mind here), we had all RH hitters (and in the three games we played in our first season, I don't think we saw a single left-handed hitter!). Near the end of the year, I turned around two girls on the team.
One girl is tiny. Under 5 feet tall (she's a sophomore this year). And I've met her parents and let's just say I don't anticipate her growing much. She's fast, though her short legs hurt her a bit. I turned her around for a couple reasons. One is that she hasn't played before, so she doesn't have years and years of batting right-handed. I have almost a fresh slate to work with. The other reason is, at her size, she's never going to be a power hitter. As a slapper she gives herself more ways to get on base (and she's closer to the base). She did OK in practice, though she wasn't great at it. Still, I didn't notice a significant drop-off from her right-handed hitting, so I'm excited to get her back out there.
The other is one of the best hitters on the team. She has played before, and she's one of two players on the team I can see playing after high school if she sticks with it and continues to develop. I turned her around because, first, I had full faith in her ability to do it. But I also saw her facing tougher competition as a right-handed hitter and seeing her being just another girl. If she takes to slapping, she will stand out a bit. She swung and missed the first two or three pitches, so naturally she wanted to quit and bat right-handed. Then she hit a couple. After a practice or two I worked with her on the footwork, and she picked it up pretty quickly. We even played a little game (using the pitching machine) where I would stand in different spots on the left side of the field and tell her to slap it right to me, and she did a great job with it. All in all, she picked it up really quickly.
Here's the catch: Every time she struggles a bit in practice, she wants to give up. Or she wants to bat right-handed just because she has more power that way (for now!). I'll tell her no, then she'll have a few nice swings lefty, and she'll like it. With this girl, you can tell when she's impressed with herself (I mean that in a good way). But still, it's a struggle to get her to completely buy in, and I'm worried that if she has a few bad games, she'll want to give up.
So how do I get her to fully buy in? I have total faith in her ability, and I've told her that. I also have no intention of abandoning the project when she struggles in games. Has anybody dealt with this with their DD where you know the potential is there and YOU are willing to take the lumps but your DD may not be?
One girl is tiny. Under 5 feet tall (she's a sophomore this year). And I've met her parents and let's just say I don't anticipate her growing much. She's fast, though her short legs hurt her a bit. I turned her around for a couple reasons. One is that she hasn't played before, so she doesn't have years and years of batting right-handed. I have almost a fresh slate to work with. The other reason is, at her size, she's never going to be a power hitter. As a slapper she gives herself more ways to get on base (and she's closer to the base). She did OK in practice, though she wasn't great at it. Still, I didn't notice a significant drop-off from her right-handed hitting, so I'm excited to get her back out there.
The other is one of the best hitters on the team. She has played before, and she's one of two players on the team I can see playing after high school if she sticks with it and continues to develop. I turned her around because, first, I had full faith in her ability to do it. But I also saw her facing tougher competition as a right-handed hitter and seeing her being just another girl. If she takes to slapping, she will stand out a bit. She swung and missed the first two or three pitches, so naturally she wanted to quit and bat right-handed. Then she hit a couple. After a practice or two I worked with her on the footwork, and she picked it up pretty quickly. We even played a little game (using the pitching machine) where I would stand in different spots on the left side of the field and tell her to slap it right to me, and she did a great job with it. All in all, she picked it up really quickly.
Here's the catch: Every time she struggles a bit in practice, she wants to give up. Or she wants to bat right-handed just because she has more power that way (for now!). I'll tell her no, then she'll have a few nice swings lefty, and she'll like it. With this girl, you can tell when she's impressed with herself (I mean that in a good way). But still, it's a struggle to get her to completely buy in, and I'm worried that if she has a few bad games, she'll want to give up.
So how do I get her to fully buy in? I have total faith in her ability, and I've told her that. I also have no intention of abandoning the project when she struggles in games. Has anybody dealt with this with their DD where you know the potential is there and YOU are willing to take the lumps but your DD may not be?
I'd highly recommend a progression like the one in the Weekly's book "High-Scoring Softball" to teach slapping. A couple of things to keep in mind is that the ideal candidate is really fast, is not a good righty hitter, highly skilled/coordinated, and is committed. If you search on it, most people have different opinions about "really fast" but 2.8 rings a bell at least for consideration past HS, to me you have to be fast enough to bunt and make it to first most of the time either by the right placement or by being so fast that it freaks out the D and they hurry the play. One girl that we turned around is about 2.9 from the right side and 2.75 (contact to 1B) from the left but she only batted about .260 (.360 OBP) at 12U and about the same in fall at 14U before we decided to turn her.
Progressions are key for the footwork and skill development but they still have to be committed, we turned 2 girls at the same time, one stuck with it and the other hated it and me by the end of the season. What worked for us was the following:
1. Progressions - One for dragbunt, one for Hard Slap, and one for Soft Slap. These are the 3 main bat movements.
2. Practice - We did 30 minutes 3x/week for 3-4 months the first year. We came early before practice and did some slapper only practices too.
3. Know what your going to do pregame, especially early on we found the girls had more confidence if we worked with them before games. 2nd year in, they know what to do (and are actually overconfident now.)
4. If she's fast there is no reason to even try to get the ball out of the infield. Even though it may not be sexy or powerful a single for a slapper is usually a double. We steal immediately, first pitch next play every time, teams that we play often know it coming and can't do anything. Point is, why hard slap and turn a .600 hitter into a .400 hitter that might occasionally get a double when our average is about .650 that she will be on 2nd base and the only negative is the next batter may have 1 strike. This is a hard thing for parents and other coaches to understand until you sit down with them and explain it.
5. You also have to work on sprinting. Ironically it helped others on the team more than our speedster, but she improved a bit, you can only go so fast so effort to maintain speed is important as girls mature.
Some comments from my experience;
- Stick with the basics, if the girl is really really fast, a good bunt at 12U and 14U will always work IMO, the hard part is getting a good bunt down all the time.
- Soft slap off the end of the bat in the 5/6 hole is harder but very effective especially if they are charging in far.
- Have a plan for bases loaded, first year we turned them back to righty because they lacked the power to drive the ball out of the infield and would K sometimes when trying to hard slap. 2nd year in they usually have power to hit a gap or drive the ball to the left side if you stick with it.
- All off-season hitting stations, have them hit (with slap, mix it up) lefty to build the swing and strength. (lots of 1 arms)
- Get professional lessons if possible. We did this after the 1st season because teams started playing the outfield on the infield and it caused problems, we had to score a 8-3 putout in our books once at State!! A college slapper gave lessons and helped with power, something a coach that never slapped could never teach or diagnose w/o knowing.
- Don't listen to everyone else about all these different types of slaps and "she should try this or that..or she hits really good lefty, let her swing away, etc.", it will hurt your team and her stats! I would say first 2 years stick with dragbunt & limited hard and soft slap. We have a .600/.700 OBP slapper when primarily bunting, why in the world would you experiment with that!
- Slappers, especially ones that they have seen get to 1st very quickly, freak out the defense, it's unbelievable how much they cheer and the other coach yells if they get her out. I would guess we've had ours score 4 times this year on overthrows to 1B; 3B freaks out after fielding the ball and seeing how far down the line she is and throws the ball to the fence down to the RF corner.
- If she's not super fast you will fail. I cannot tell you how many bang/bang plays we have at 1B, especially against the good A/B teams. 0.1 seconds slower and she has 1/3 less hits, maybe more. If you plan to get hits based on slapping placement year 1, it's going to be really, really hard IMO!
Here's our actual results for our current (and only slapper this last year).
12U - Righty hitter ~.250/.350 (AVG/OBP)
14U Fall, sill righty .259/.367
Turned lefty this off-season
14U 1st season - .398/.486 - 38 SB (37 games)
14U Fall Ball - .667/.815 - 20 SB (10 games)
HS JV team - .543/.614 - did not track SB guess would be 45 - she started to get aggressive, delayed steals, etc.
14U 2nd Season - .564/.642 - 69 SB (33 games)
Had she done a bit more bunting instead of experimenting or practicing slaps, I'm sure she would have been over .625 easy. So the upside of a slapper is huge. You just have to fight the urge of the slapper and everyone else to do a bunch of fancy slaps, stick with what works and for us it's a runner on 2B 65% of the time. I would say only turn around a girl if you need to get her on base because of her speed and she cannot hit her way on now.
Good luck.
Progressions are key for the footwork and skill development but they still have to be committed, we turned 2 girls at the same time, one stuck with it and the other hated it and me by the end of the season. What worked for us was the following:
1. Progressions - One for dragbunt, one for Hard Slap, and one for Soft Slap. These are the 3 main bat movements.
2. Practice - We did 30 minutes 3x/week for 3-4 months the first year. We came early before practice and did some slapper only practices too.
3. Know what your going to do pregame, especially early on we found the girls had more confidence if we worked with them before games. 2nd year in, they know what to do (and are actually overconfident now.)
4. If she's fast there is no reason to even try to get the ball out of the infield. Even though it may not be sexy or powerful a single for a slapper is usually a double. We steal immediately, first pitch next play every time, teams that we play often know it coming and can't do anything. Point is, why hard slap and turn a .600 hitter into a .400 hitter that might occasionally get a double when our average is about .650 that she will be on 2nd base and the only negative is the next batter may have 1 strike. This is a hard thing for parents and other coaches to understand until you sit down with them and explain it.
5. You also have to work on sprinting. Ironically it helped others on the team more than our speedster, but she improved a bit, you can only go so fast so effort to maintain speed is important as girls mature.
Some comments from my experience;
- Stick with the basics, if the girl is really really fast, a good bunt at 12U and 14U will always work IMO, the hard part is getting a good bunt down all the time.
- Soft slap off the end of the bat in the 5/6 hole is harder but very effective especially if they are charging in far.
- Have a plan for bases loaded, first year we turned them back to righty because they lacked the power to drive the ball out of the infield and would K sometimes when trying to hard slap. 2nd year in they usually have power to hit a gap or drive the ball to the left side if you stick with it.
- All off-season hitting stations, have them hit (with slap, mix it up) lefty to build the swing and strength. (lots of 1 arms)
- Get professional lessons if possible. We did this after the 1st season because teams started playing the outfield on the infield and it caused problems, we had to score a 8-3 putout in our books once at State!! A college slapper gave lessons and helped with power, something a coach that never slapped could never teach or diagnose w/o knowing.
- Don't listen to everyone else about all these different types of slaps and "she should try this or that..or she hits really good lefty, let her swing away, etc.", it will hurt your team and her stats! I would say first 2 years stick with dragbunt & limited hard and soft slap. We have a .600/.700 OBP slapper when primarily bunting, why in the world would you experiment with that!
- Slappers, especially ones that they have seen get to 1st very quickly, freak out the defense, it's unbelievable how much they cheer and the other coach yells if they get her out. I would guess we've had ours score 4 times this year on overthrows to 1B; 3B freaks out after fielding the ball and seeing how far down the line she is and throws the ball to the fence down to the RF corner.
- If she's not super fast you will fail. I cannot tell you how many bang/bang plays we have at 1B, especially against the good A/B teams. 0.1 seconds slower and she has 1/3 less hits, maybe more. If you plan to get hits based on slapping placement year 1, it's going to be really, really hard IMO!
Here's our actual results for our current (and only slapper this last year).
12U - Righty hitter ~.250/.350 (AVG/OBP)
14U Fall, sill righty .259/.367
Turned lefty this off-season
14U 1st season - .398/.486 - 38 SB (37 games)
14U Fall Ball - .667/.815 - 20 SB (10 games)
HS JV team - .543/.614 - did not track SB guess would be 45 - she started to get aggressive, delayed steals, etc.
14U 2nd Season - .564/.642 - 69 SB (33 games)
Had she done a bit more bunting instead of experimenting or practicing slaps, I'm sure she would have been over .625 easy. So the upside of a slapper is huge. You just have to fight the urge of the slapper and everyone else to do a bunch of fancy slaps, stick with what works and for us it's a runner on 2B 65% of the time. I would say only turn around a girl if you need to get her on base because of her speed and she cannot hit her way on now.
Good luck.
Any idea what's considered a good speed at the HS level? We had an open field on Wednesday and our two slappers (sophomores) were there. Toward the end they wanted me to time their speed to first. Another player and I both had a stopwatch (well, cell phones) going. I had both girls around 3.2-3.3 on average, and this is without doing any kind of speed training. I told both we were going to get them down to 3 seconds, which certainly isn't elite speed but I imagine would be plenty good for the HS level.
The rest of your post is really helpful. Thanks!
3.0 is certainly fast enough to be a decent HS slapper.
If a player is faster than 3.0 and is willing to commit to it I would turn her around If she wants to do it. If she is already a lefty, adding slapping is just a bonus. DD was a very good right-handed hitter but is also very fast. Because of her speed she is far more effective from the left side. She initially missed the great feeling of really ripping a shot in the gap, but a huge boost in avg and OBP made her understand that slapping was the way to go for her. She developed an understanding that hit, walk, HBP, or ROE all end up with her on base and then she gets to steal. She has been laser timed, stopwatch timed, pylon timed, etc... and I think she runs somewhere between 2.8 and 2.9. She took an offer from her dream school at that speed. I don't think she is in the 2.7 range. Can she get there? Maybe, with the speed training she will get at school. At this point she can't rely only on her short game. She has to keep the defense honest and be able to hard slap a shot down the line past the left fielder for a double. She can also drop a bunt when slapping (not a drag bunt) and that slap motion freezes the defense for a split second because the corner infielders have to respect the fact that she can slap one by them. When she started working with a true slapping coach it made a big difference.
My point is that you don't have to be sub 2.8 to be effective as a slapper even at a high level. However, you have to have something more than your short game if you aren't a true burner. If a kid is a burner I would still try to teach her to hard slap because it just adds a dimension to your game. Swing away once in awhile!
If a player is faster than 3.0 and is willing to commit to it I would turn her around If she wants to do it. If she is already a lefty, adding slapping is just a bonus. DD was a very good right-handed hitter but is also very fast. Because of her speed she is far more effective from the left side. She initially missed the great feeling of really ripping a shot in the gap, but a huge boost in avg and OBP made her understand that slapping was the way to go for her. She developed an understanding that hit, walk, HBP, or ROE all end up with her on base and then she gets to steal. She has been laser timed, stopwatch timed, pylon timed, etc... and I think she runs somewhere between 2.8 and 2.9. She took an offer from her dream school at that speed. I don't think she is in the 2.7 range. Can she get there? Maybe, with the speed training she will get at school. At this point she can't rely only on her short game. She has to keep the defense honest and be able to hard slap a shot down the line past the left fielder for a double. She can also drop a bunt when slapping (not a drag bunt) and that slap motion freezes the defense for a split second because the corner infielders have to respect the fact that she can slap one by them. When she started working with a true slapping coach it made a big difference.
My point is that you don't have to be sub 2.8 to be effective as a slapper even at a high level. However, you have to have something more than your short game if you aren't a true burner. If a kid is a burner I would still try to teach her to hard slap because it just adds a dimension to your game. Swing away once in awhile!
