How important are stats?

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Jun 11, 2013
2,619
113
But which one is correct? In our game, I believe our scorekeeper was correct. Case in point, our pitcher fielded a bunt, dropped it, then threw to 1B late. Our scorekeeper gave an E-1... the "official" scorekeepers at the game gave a hit.
It depends on why she dropped the ball. Was it a simple bunt right at her that she just flubbed, or did she have to barehand it or try and make a do or die play to try and get the out? How fast was the runner,etc.

There will be a lot of gray plays that can go either way.
 
Jul 16, 2008
1,520
48
Oregon
It depends on why she dropped the ball. Was it a simple bunt right at her that she just flubbed, or did she have to barehand it or try and make a do or die play to try and get the out? How fast was the runner,etc.

There will be a lot of gray plays that can go either way.

No she flubbed it... A SAC bunt right to her :)
 
Nov 18, 2015
1,585
113
That's not a stolen base, that's defensive indifference. The problem you have is a scorekeeper that doesn't know how to properly keep score.

I don't think anyone else addressed this, but I believe the situation as described is a stolen base.

Defensive indifference is when "the player’s advance is perceived to have no bearing on the outcome of the game." Easiest example is a team is up by 10+ runs late in a game. Doesn't matter if it's 1st and 3rd or 2nd and 3rd, defense is just focusing on the batter and getting the out. They don't care if the score is 15-2 or 15-3.

As JD described it, the catcher doesn't throw b/c they know they won't get the runner, and if they do throw (my assumption here), the runner at 3rd walks on home. It's a SB when there's a strategic reason to NOT throw down (keep the runner at 3rd). (IIRC, this example is flushed out in the OBR). The exception to this is when R3 is the winning run with 0 outs - that turns it back to DI b/c turning a DP won't end the inning (see below).

Also wanted to note - I checked "The Official National Collegiate Athletic Association Baseball and Softball Scorebook", which has been referenced in several other threads, and I've found very useful myself. There's no mention of the word "indifference" in the Softball section. However, after doing a google search, I found a reference to NCAA Rule 14.2.7. Based on the URL, I'm assuming (again!) this is the 2018 version. When I checked the document properties on the Scorebook pdf I have, it looks like that document was from 2002, although I think it's still buried somewhere on the NCAA website.

So it looks like "Defensive Indifference" has since been added to the rule book. Whether this has filtered down to, or was ever a part of NFHS rulesets, I can't say.

Final note - the NCAA rulebook includes the winning run scenario / exception mentioned above.

Glad I can muddy the water on that one!
 

CoachMikeD

Teach First, Win Later!
Dec 29, 2018
15
3
Conover NC
Depends on whether you trust the person doing the book... :LOL:
I occasionally do scorekeeping seminars. I have found that there are those that don't know, don't care, and don't want to know. And there are those who think they know but only sort of know. Then some in between. Considering how many people say they are afraid of keeping score because they think they will mess it up, you'd think I would get more people wanting training. LOL.
 

CoachMikeD

Teach First, Win Later!
Dec 29, 2018
15
3
Conover NC
Why is talking generally with a coach about how they think about playing time or batting lineup somehow off limits? A coach who is secure with his thought process shouldn't have any problem sharing it with a player, parent, or bystander. For the team AND parents, it really shouldn't be any sort of secret.
I always told my parents here's my phone number, you can call me anytime. And I will discuss playing time. HOWEVER, I don't want to hear from you the day off the game, period. As for playing time, I will discuss it. Many coaches won't. I would rather hear from the player if she wants to know how she can get more playing time. Parents, if you want to know why your daughter isn't playing more...ask her. Not always but usually the players know. And one more qualification, I will talk playing time, however, parents (and players) need to understand it is the COACH's decision. Sometimes there may not be a stat that explains it. Sometimes it may be a gut feeling that this player is going to shine today. Maybe a coach might put a player in to fire up another player. There are many reasons and they don't always have to be about stats.
 
May 15, 2011
10
3
I like stats to use as a backup to what I think I'm seeing. The 2 things that can be missed is a kid who has a couple of great hits every weekend that everyone remembers but has an OBP of 200 and the kid who is getting on a lot but doesn't have anything that you really remember but has a 500 OBP.
Yuuup
 

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