How was Mike Lotief at NFCA this year ?
Hitting Questions?
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RayR
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I see lack of good hitting posture being the biggest culprit in pulling off the ball. More specifically, hitters not getting in and staying in a good athletic position.
If they start straightening up during the swing they will pull off.
MTS -
That is how a non-mlb 1 plane middle out swing works to kee the shoulder in there.
The more you are bent over, the less the front shoulder flies out when you rotate.
That is not what keeps the front shoulder in in an MLB swing pattern.
The front shoulder stays in because of the resistance created by the arms/hands/shoulders/scaps working to turn the bat in a steeper plane than the hips turn the body.
upper and lower body synch in the two plane pattern as opposed to the middle out action of the one plane pattern.
This somewhat separate upper body/arm action is what Candrea/Slaught mean by their "free and independent" description.
That is how a non-mlb 1 plane middle out swing works to kee the shoulder in there.
The more you are bent over, the less the front shoulder flies out when you rotate.
That is not what keeps the front shoulder in in an MLB swing pattern.
The front shoulder stays in because of the resistance created by the arms/hands/shoulders/scaps working to turn the bat in a steeper plane than the hips turn the body.
upper and lower body synch in the two plane pattern as opposed to the middle out action of the one plane pattern.
This somewhat separate upper body/arm action is what Candrea/Slaught mean by their "free and independent" description.
OR, you can assume these guys disagree for a reason, and rather than embarking on an endless Quixotic quest to find some imagined glue that holds them all together, simply choose one that on its own works well to get kids successful.
Alternatively, you can just go out an hit with a kid. You should try it, Tom. It is very NON-theoretical. Kind of like the difference between reading about something in a medical journal, and actually performing surgery. . . .
Skeptic -
I do find that you can mix and match pieces/drills from various authorites with good results and I have worked hard to account for this theoretically.
Sarge/scott,for example was of the opinion that mixing and matching was counterproductive and has recommended more of the one true guru approach, but maybe he has changed his thinking.
A concrete/content containing discussion might be fun here.
DO you mix and match ?
Do you have rules of thumb that guide how you apply information from different sources ?
Perhaps we could stick to the purpose here of "discussing fastpitch"
I do find that you can mix and match pieces/drills from various authorites with good results and I have worked hard to account for this theoretically.
Sarge/scott,for example was of the opinion that mixing and matching was counterproductive and has recommended more of the one true guru approach, but maybe he has changed his thinking.
A concrete/content containing discussion might be fun here.
DO you mix and match ?
Do you have rules of thumb that guide how you apply information from different sources ?
Perhaps we could stick to the purpose here of "discussing fastpitch"
You guys are going to scare people off.
I know who and what your talking about, but the original poster is new to the forum and this was his/her first post. If this person isn't familiar with the "high level, elite, torque, MLB pattern, core, tilt, swing plane" jargon, they probably think y'all are crazy and will go back to asking some rec ball coach what they think.
Debate each other all you want, but sometimes a simple opinion as to a fix or to a good video works too.
Just my opinion and I'm just as guilty as you are when it comes to hitting and recruiting. I can always tell by that glazed-over look I get from other parents.
I know who and what your talking about, but the original poster is new to the forum and this was his/her first post. If this person isn't familiar with the "high level, elite, torque, MLB pattern, core, tilt, swing plane" jargon, they probably think y'all are crazy and will go back to asking some rec ball coach what they think.
Debate each other all you want, but sometimes a simple opinion as to a fix or to a good video works too.
Just my opinion and I'm just as guilty as you are when it comes to hitting and recruiting. I can always tell by that glazed-over look I get from other parents.
good point tex -
so I would recommend teaching a good overhand throw and an MLB pattern swing starting young.
For throwing, Nyman's ebook or wolforths program are good starting points.
for hitting Epstein is very accessible.
They need expert oversight to be applied.
And time and dedication
That is about as easy as it will get.
so I would recommend teaching a good overhand throw and an MLB pattern swing starting young.
For throwing, Nyman's ebook or wolforths program are good starting points.
for hitting Epstein is very accessible.
They need expert oversight to be applied.
And time and dedication
That is about as easy as it will get.
R
RayR
Guest
So, you are disagreeing with the idea that kids who pop up/straighten up during the swing don't pull off the ball and tend to NOT swing over the pitch or hit off of the end of the bat?
I work with, coach and parent REAL kids. I am not teaching a MLB pattern swing (whatever that is). I am trying to get kids to hit better then they are currently hitting and find that a simple thing like being and staying in an athletic position helps TONS.
And every hitter posted here:
Fastpitch
is in and stays in this position.
The best advice anyone can give is to watch these clips and try to do exactly as they do which is:
1. Get into an athletic stance
2. Keep your hands up and barrel above your hands at about a 45 degree angle
3. Turn your hips then your shoulders while still doing 1 and 2.
Tom, you need to quit trying to demonstrate (to a bunch of parents and coaches trying to help KIDS get better) how much more intellectually superior you are. Save that shirt for the Bulldog reunion party...
Good post MTS. Notice how the swings all look the same. They may start in different postions but they are basically the same. Have watched many of these swings on RVP and since I work with Bustos's coach, we tend to base our teaching off of her swing.
MTS-
Happy holdays to you.
I agree with your assessment of how the nonmlb patern works. That can be fine for you but it is not what you are seeing in clips of MLB hitters.
Rather than bend over and stick the butt out and staying down "in posture", MLB hitters tend to be more upright and sit more or less as part of axis/up/down adjustment. The posture adjustment is more or less of a sitting action which is a very distinctly different action/feel from bend at waist.
The arms and at are controlling setting up a matching plane, the plane is not being set by bend at waist. The axis being set is best thought of as leaning more or less toward pitcher as Epstein describes it.
Young ones are quite able to emulate the MLB swing and able to throw in a high level pattern. I recommend shooting for that as the way to achieve the goal.
You are certainly welcome to teach bending over and maintaining posture.
Ultimately I find teaching is about getting close enough to be captured by an inherent pattern and I would prefer to shoot for the MLB pattern since it is closely related to a high level overhand throw and learning this high level throw and the mlb swing leverage one another.
If a dad/mom/coach does not feel qualified to teach the MLB throw or swing, you might consider finding a coach familiar with these motions.
Happy holdays to you.
I agree with your assessment of how the nonmlb patern works. That can be fine for you but it is not what you are seeing in clips of MLB hitters.
Rather than bend over and stick the butt out and staying down "in posture", MLB hitters tend to be more upright and sit more or less as part of axis/up/down adjustment. The posture adjustment is more or less of a sitting action which is a very distinctly different action/feel from bend at waist.
The arms and at are controlling setting up a matching plane, the plane is not being set by bend at waist. The axis being set is best thought of as leaning more or less toward pitcher as Epstein describes it.
Young ones are quite able to emulate the MLB swing and able to throw in a high level pattern. I recommend shooting for that as the way to achieve the goal.
You are certainly welcome to teach bending over and maintaining posture.
Ultimately I find teaching is about getting close enough to be captured by an inherent pattern and I would prefer to shoot for the MLB pattern since it is closely related to a high level overhand throw and learning this high level throw and the mlb swing leverage one another.
If a dad/mom/coach does not feel qualified to teach the MLB throw or swing, you might consider finding a coach familiar with these motions.
