Help with my 14U daughter

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Oct 13, 2014
5,471
113
South Cali
The definition of Cast speaks nothing to the mechanics involved in how one actually throws a object. IMO only the "extending and drop is simply the top hand reaching back for more and bottom hand going along with it. . Although I guess one could see it as more leveling (Aiming).

The difference between what Blackmon is doing with his wrist vs the posters DD, is that Blackmon is actually acting on the bat handle vs the posters DD hand just rotates/slips around the handle of the bat, with the top hand independent of the bottom hand. Both the top and bottom hand of Blackmon actually apply force in unison on the bat handle. Posters DD does not. Again look at the following gif. Notice the blue stripe on the top hand batting glove moves independent of the bottom hand with is competely stationary and compare to blackmon that you posted. I personally believe that's because blackmon know how to have active hands especially the bottom hand



maybe bc the lead shoulder is dead? Or not loaded? Leveraged? It’s a chain of movements CL. The bottom hand pulling is ok. But it must be done w the slack out. Does the young lady take the slack out when Blackmon does? Why not?

edit: looking at one piece can/is misleading. Cause and effect is the swing.
 
Feb 25, 2020
953
93
She lays it down and swings it around. I'd fix that before worrying about all the minutia.(addresses bat drag).

Blackmon's barrel goes down because he moves the handle forward(and down).

Edit to offer my opinion on a solution: Practice swings like this. Hit low tees like this. (First swing at the very beginning.)

 
Last edited:
Oct 2, 2017
2,283
113
maybe bc the lead shoulder is dead? Or not loaded? Leveraged? It’s a chain of movements CL. The bottom hand pulling is ok. But it must be done w the slack out. Does the young lady take the slack out when Blackmon does? Why not?

edit: looking at one piece can/is misleading. Cause and effect is the swing.

Agree with this.
 

fanboi22

on the journey
Nov 9, 2015
1,138
83
SE Wisconsin
Not saying my kid is perfect, but we have also been going thru the journey and trying to understand all this. In the link below it will take you to my DD's thread showing the same thing your DD is going thru. Top hand is slipping and elbow slotting without moving the bat at all and casting with bat drag.

https://www.discussfastpitch.com/th...g-mechanics-what-to-work-on.35342/post-570881

i have copied the two main photos from that post showing before toe touch her top elbow horizontal with ground, Then right at or before heel down her elbow is pointing at the ground with limited turn or movement in the barrel. @efastball gave you a good visual of that in one of the first posts. Below is another from my DD. If the first GIF which are really those same two photos you can see her also casting away from her body when she 'launches' her swing.

The last GIF is what we had been working on. We took away her stride to simplify and kept her barrel more vertical and less lengthening (or walking away) of the lead arm. Some have mentioned that this creates less of/or no loading or stretch, which i agree but we had to take care of the big issues first. But we were trying to keep her hands up at her shoulder at launch and connected during the initial rotation. It was really a cue of 'punch' the top hand thru. We had worked on separate drills for the top hand and bottom hand trying to stay high. I think Billy Ripken may have some videos on something like it. We also worked on a drill that keeps the bottom hand normal and then turns the top hand upside down with open palm. it forces her to keep the barrel high until launch and create hand force and allows her to 'feel' where the hands should be during the swing. If she doesn't 'use her hands' the barrel dumps and gets away from her. I think there was a video on here somewhere with a youth baseball coach using that drill.

For the lower half we were also working on the feeling of her rear leg twisting out, or said differently applying pressure with her little toe to turn clockwise out. This external rotation helps set the leg and allow for coil as she moves forward. Her forward move is without a stride obviously, but instead the hips. Not sure if technically correct, but she feels the coil/pressure thru the move forward.

There is definitely more work to be done, but her contact and quickness has improved tremendously.

We are working more currently on keeping her hands high and not dropping them which forces her to use posture and tilt to get the barrel to the ball. This creates more force than just the arms could do going down after the ball. This then also creates the 'swing down to' concept. you can see that a little in the bottom GIF.

Hope some of this helps. Good luck.

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fanboi22

on the journey
Nov 9, 2015
1,138
83
SE Wisconsin
Here is an example of that drill, however i have my DD keep the top hand open. i have seen another one that has the top hand farther up the barrel as well. I don't like that as it doesn't give the same feel.

I will also put the ball low and outside which i feel really helps with posture. This drill really doesn't let the top elbow slot which is one reason why i like it. Just my opinion again.

 
Aug 2, 2019
343
63
Here is an example of that drill, however i have my DD keep the top hand open. i have seen another one that has the top hand farther up the barrel as well. I don't like that as it doesn't give the same feel.

I will also put the ball low and outside which i feel really helps with posture. This drill really doesn't let the top elbow slot which is one reason why i like it. Just my opinion again.


First look I was thinking that drill looks ridiculous. Then I just grabbed a bat and did it. Three girls on my team just got prescribed this drill. The caster, and the two that pull their elbows together.
 

fanboi22

on the journey
Nov 9, 2015
1,138
83
SE Wisconsin
First look I was thinking that drill looks ridiculous. Then I just grabbed a bat and did it. Three girls on my team just got prescribed this drill. The caster, and the two that pull their elbows together.
As a note i couldn't find the original baseball one i referenced. I think he was some high school coach with a great record, but only found this one and one from Mallee i think his name is. It is also beneficial to try and get better posture with this drill. Stay more on the backside.
 
Oct 13, 2014
5,471
113
South Cali
Getting the hips to get forward while the shoulders go back is the key to a sequential load. It leads to disassociation, which leads to a stretch reflex and moving from the middle. And eventually a launch from the middle. The energy needs to stay within the body until contact w the ball.

1619014560213.gif

With FBs dd she gets everything back and brings everything forward. Opening the upper to early. Leads to a pushy swing Imo.

the original posters dd gets everything back but keeps her upper body back while her lower gets leveraged. She’s unbalanced.

one casts the other pushes. One bc she cant use her middle and the other bc she cant load her upper body on time and is late. so she casts.

the Ted Williams quote, ‘the hips lead the hands’ is what’s missing for FBs dd. Ted used to say he kept his front hip closed. That was the hip coil he proclaimed was so important. not the back hip, contrary to hitting forum lore. This is how he created his ‘stretch reflex’ or his hips leading his hands. Basically by staying closed on his front side. By keeping the front knee closed or just facing the plate during stride and letting the swing open the knee, this can be accomplished. Notice the action of the front leg. Does it open before he starts swinging or is it the result? Notice how the hips turn before launch of the hands(swing).That is disassociation.

1619015077996.gif

the OP dd is just getting back to far then her middle/upper gets stuck. Different problems same solution imo. Her first swing posted there wasn’t a stretch reflex. she somewhat fixed her posture via the chest/knees and a stretch reflex appeared. The drag decreased significantly as well.

the thought should be to just fully weight the rear heel. that’s all that’s needed to create a good load. Getting the weight back a bit is enough. Weight the rear leg. get enough back so you can control it going forward. The head staying somewhat forward is a good meter for this. CB said ‘keep the head between the hips’. Good cue.

1619015856339.gif


both of these players over cook the gather portion and compensate from there.

I use a cue of keeping the head still while weighting the rear heel. You could even start on the rear heel. And get forward against the hands staying back. While keeping the frontside closed. Last part is what is usually missing from every kid out there. Both will create the movement from the middle and get rid of the compensations w the hands that these players are creating.
 
Jan 6, 2009
6,591
113
Chehalis, Wa
In the last few days I’ve been thinking of the cue take the back shoulder to the ball. Which is really just tilt over the plate.

Since I’m a Mariners fan, I’ve been watching Haniger. I think the cue of taking the back shoulder to the ball is a good one for maintaining tilt.
 
Feb 18, 2021
27
3
Too many people to respond to but you guys are awesome. No quick fixes but she's doing better each day! Before I read any of these, here is what we've been working on:

-practicing knob to the ball, using that lead as a hammer
-bat vertical keeping it still through load and not casting nor curling it around her head and laying it down horizontally

This week we're going to practice that drill with the reverse hand. She is doing much better with the casting and shortening the path to the ball and not throwing her hands. I really see the issues with the load and transfer you spoke of. I'm worried if I mess with her stride, it will screw up her timing mid season. Do you feel she is loading back but transfering her weight back forward? Seems like she doesn't. You can see her kinda fall after she swings. She's so out of balance.

Heres from today:







 

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