Forearm Fire vs IR

[NewBucketDad]

i will save Boardmember the time.

Here is my personal review...........

The simple fact is that very much of Coach Phil's information comes from THIS SITE..........Often embellishing the information into an instructional video..........

Sometimes the information he "re-packages" and/or "re-names" from this site is accurate........Sometimes it isn't. Because it's HIS OWN interpretation of that information shared here. Part of the problem is he's not a pitcher. He's never thrown a pitch at any level above his instructional snippets........And it becomes obvious when you watch his bio-mechanics in demonstration..........

I can't begin to tell you how many of his "Video Blogs" are filmed and published sometime AFTER that exact information was discussed here on this site. In short, he uses much of what is discussed on this site by advanced level instructors to formulate his information and then re-packages/re-distributes that information under sometimes different terms/pet names to make it his own.......

I can't tell you how many people watch his clips and then write me to tell me about the obvious plagiarism of information I've discussed on here before his clips are published.

Here's what I will tell you. His "Forearm Fire" was plagiarized directly from my I/R thread........His "Hand action series part 1" clip was plagiarized directly from my I/R in the classroom thread. His "hitting and forearm fire" clip was a direct result of my "bat drill for pitchers".......All published LONG AFTER I made the information available on this site.......

The GOOD THING is that he has taken/extracted much/all of the important information discussed on this site and put it into video's that DO NOT require reading through all chaff to find the wheat.........Or digging though the "hay stacks" to find the needles............ The bad thing is in making some of it "his own" he's twisted some of it in the wrong direction.......

I don't have the time to dissect what is the best and what is the worst of "Fastpich Power"........And like ALL information available out there, and all the different theories and methods, the best advice I can give you is to pick through what makes sense to you.......Try it......And keep what works and throw out what doesn't..........

SO.........With all that said...........I've seen a lot of his video-blog clips........I would categorize them as generally Ok.......But his interpretations and embellishments are not always the best, or even correct mechanically.......Especially stuff like this example of an "elbow snapping" move that doesn't exist in any high level delivery:

Coach Phil has made a business of teaching the fastpitch motion. IMO he's done a generally decent job of categorizing that information into teachable segments.

He appears likable, and he speaks generally well in his videos, using clear and concise verbiage to get his points across, which makes his "sales-ability" factor "believable".........Which is a good quality in both an instructor, and a used car salesman........It's up to you to decide whether that car is worth investing in........It could be a diamond in the rough.......Or a lemon........

SHOW ME THE CAR FAX!

 

[knightsb]

i will save Boardmember the time.

I will save javasource the time

 

[lhowser]

The review reposted above by NewBucketDad (can't speak about the intentionally plagerizing discussed) is good. In general the teaching, enthusiasm and sincerity of Phil make the videos very good. But this post is about forearm fire. If a player were to literally replicate forearm fire as it is demonstrated on the blog they would not have success. It is not what you see the players doing in the Model pitching thread. To the degree that forearm fire is closer in many aspects to the natural internal rotation seen in the Model Pitchers thread than what people call "hello elbow" it is good.

 

[Rocketech1]

I think the biggest difference between everyone else's understanding of arm whip and Boardmember's explanation is that BM knows that to generate maximum velocity and spin rate, you HAVE to be "internally rotating the shoulder, upper arm, forearm, and hand from 9:00 (palm to sky) into and through 6:00 (release)". Essentially pulling the ball down the circle while simultaneuosly rotating the arm and hand into release. If you don't understand that critical concept, nothing else really matters.

 

[lollygagger84]

i will save Boardmember the time.

thanks for all the input, I'm obviously newer to this site and didn't know BM had discussed it in detail thanks again

 

[JJsqueeze]

thanks for all the input, I'm obviously newer to this site and didn't know BM had discussed it in detail thanks again

Its all good. If you can find an instructional video that has not been discussed here then I will be impressed... One of my favorite debunking threads was this one...I found this one very funny, mostly because this PCs bag seemed to be bottom less and he was so confident in the instruction he was giving...
http://www.discussfastpitch.com/softball-pitching/17318-take-look.html

 

[1bucketmom]

Its all good. If you can find an instructional video that has not been discussed here then I will be impressed... One of my favorite debunking threads was this one...I found this one very funny, mostly because this PCs bag seemed to be bottom less and he was so confident in the instruction he was giving...
http://www.discussfastpitch.com/softball-pitching/17318-take-look.html

This just makes me soooooooo thankful I stumbled upon DFP!!!!! I would have been one of those moms that fell into that type of video thinking I was helping. Although, I must say that bag of tricks is pretty amazing. I pack less for a week long vacation.

 

[lollygagger84]

Its all good. If you can find an instructional video that has not been discussed here then I will be impressed... One of my favorite debunking threads was this one...I found this one very funny, mostly because this PCs bag seemed to be bottom less and he was so confident in the instruction he was giving...
http://www.discussfastpitch.com/softball-pitching/17318-take-look.html

LMBO wow can't believe they actually posted it haha. Thanks again squeeze, good times

 

[Ken B]

Hmmm…

Forearm Fire is very different. Whip with I/R relies heavily on the articulation of the elbow/forearm. Forearm Fire places a stronger emphasis on wrist snap for power and ignores the importance of adduction of the upper arm and transfer of energy to the lower arm. In FF, it’s assumed the upper arm adds nothing to the pitch after 12 o’clock and that gravity is the only power source affecting the arm and release. Interestingly, if you watch the presenter demonstrate each, things look very similar until well after release.

Dang! I thought I had a better understanding of IR/whip in ‘14.

My ‘21 understanding is that both IR and FF are similar from 12 to about 8 o’clock. The upper arm pulls the lower arm and ball down the backside of the circle in a lagged/flexed position. This is where the differences start.

In FF, the elbow extends and the wrist snaps, like a karate chop. Brush trigger is not possible.

In IR, the forearm maintains flexion as the humerus rotates. The forearm is free to brush/wrap/roll around the thigh, triggering release.

FF & IR Comparison

FF achieves whip by unhinging, or extension at the elbow. IR maintains flexion throughout release and utilizes upper arm compression and forearm brush to as...

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