Fielding % (like batting average except for the defense)

[KrisHur]

It may look lazy but like Coach JD stated above that's just an opinion - not an error. Whether they dive or not doesn't matter. If they dive and the ball deflects off their glove or squirts out that's not an error. If they dive and make a fantastic play that everyone loses their minds over then that's an awesome extraordinary play. If they dive, glove the ball and make a terrible throw that's a throwing error. Stats are stats and opinions don't really come into play.

Isn't that what I just said? Errors are subjective and should be judged case by case.

 

[nikkilugi]

Isn't that what I just said? Errors are subjective and should be judged case by case.

You also said "diving should be expected" and that is not the case. Diving is extraordinary effort every time. Lazy looking or not it's not an error - there is no subjectiveness to it.

 

[radness]

Yet another hypothetical discussion for the purpose of discussion breaking down into name calling - SMH. I do not think it was Rad's intention (ever) to troll anyone. JMHO, we can discuss on a case by case basis about errors and giving the batter the hit as per the scoring rules but diving should be expected and not considered extra effort. Maybe not at 10U but definitely at 16U. When I see a play where a dive is warranted and the fielder doesn't go for it, it looks lazy, JMO YMMV

Thank you!!!!!

 

[radness]

You also said "diving should be expected" and that is not the case. Diving is extraordinary effort every time. Lazy looking or not it's not an error - there is no subjectiveness to it.

Diving should be expected on the field!
By all players.


Think your comment is crossing the line between the expectation on the field
and how the score keeper keeps the books.

These two separate elements,
while they may be in conflict of interest to stats, both are part of the game.
This may have been part of the discussion dispute/conundrum
earlier?!

 

[JayW]

The reason better defenders often get more errors isn't because they're graded harder. It's because they get to more balls than lesser defenders.

Agreed.

 

[nikkilugi]

Diving should be expected on the field!
By all players.


Think your comment is crossing the line between the expectation on the field
and how the score keeper keeps the books.

These two separate elements,
while they may be in conflict of interest to stats, both are part of the game.
This may have been part of the discussion dispute/conundrum
earlier?!

When you are putting it in a discussion about stats it is an untrue statement. Like I stated earlier you are talking about coaching decisions - not stats so don't bring up diving in a stats related discussion. So yes it is two separate elements and maybe a new discussion topic should be started about coaching decisions that are totally separate from stats because stats doesn't expect diving - ever.

 

[radness]

Talking to players/teams about defense.
Can be approached by talking to the team about developing Fielding stats and average.

As discussed it may be hard to interpret individual plays, with players shuffling around on the field different positions. There is still a accumulated team stats.
There can be the approach of discussing building team defensive stats
Not by pointing out error after error.

That is why I shared in my original post when I was a player I used to think don't screw up don't make an error. It wasn't until I was in college that a coach approached me talking about building defensive stats. He did not walk up and say
'hey you committed this error.'
He approached me with the fielding avg..

 

[radness]

@nikkilugi ,
No debate about your comments. But I will share this towards the way this post went.

Goal is To bring out feedback and perspectives. Some topics are going to have conflicting points of interest. Like the two separate perspectives in this discussion
1. what happens on the field
2. what happens on the books.
(as you said two separate elements. Good to agree there)

With that clarified,
Generally coaches do not say to their team
'hey if you can't reach the play on your feet, dive, it won't be counted as an error if you miss it.'
Coaches do say things like 'hey we had too many errors in that game'...

In my original post I told a story of how it was in my mind to 'not screw up, don't have an error'.
It wasn't until I was in college that a coach approached me with a positive perspective by utilizing the words 'Fielding average.'

Saying
'Fielding Average'
is communicating something we can Build.
We don't have to talk about errors we can talk about completing plays and building our Fielding average.

 

[KrisHur]

You also said "diving should be expected" and that is not the case. Diving is extraordinary effort every time. Lazy looking or not it's not an error - there is no subjectiveness to it.

You keep saying it as if I said it but I never said not diving is an error. That it should be expected is my opinion for sure. And that it's extraordinary is yours. OK to disagree but when at that college camp and the coach sees player 1 stand there to watch a hard hit grounder roll by but player 2 dives who do you think she's recruiting?

 

[nikkilugi]

You keep saying it as if I said it but I never said not diving is an error. That it should be expected is my opinion for sure. And that it's extraordinary is yours. OK to disagree but when at that college camp and the coach sees player 1 stand there to watch a hard hit grounder roll by but player 2 dives who do you think she's recruiting?

No - extraordinary is my opinion as a scorekeeper. If you read the other comment I posted above I absolutely said diving is expected on the field by coaches and is my opinion as a parent. (scroll up a few posts). However my literal interpretation of this thread was talking about fielding stats like "fielding average". That is a stat related discussion and diving doesn't play any part of that.