Don’t Touch the Players

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Nov 20, 2020
995
93
SW Missouri
My bad I totally misinterpreted what you were saying, when I initially read "shoulder rubbing" I thought of a coach's and player's each individual shoulders rubbing against each other. Seemed like a weird idea that I didn't quite understand. But if you mean shoulder rubbing like a massage type of action then yes I agree with you, unless for injury purposes, shoulder rubbing shouldn't take place. My bad for the misunderstanding.

All good! I didn't express it very clearly either. Just a good example of how people perceive things differently!
 
Jul 16, 2013
4,659
113
Pennsylvania
I understand, that has happened to me to. Some players that I work with will send me their schedules and ask me to come out to the games. I go and at the end of the game sometimes they'll come in for a hug. I try my best to keep it to a fist bump and not make it awkward.

Same thing here. The college DD plays for and the college her TB catcher plays for are rivals. We run into them every season. After the games she typically comes up to me and gives me a quick hug. I coached her for multiple years, but we are more like family friends than coach/player. While she is hugging me, my DD is typically hugging her father (coached with me)... Again, she initiates the contact and we keep it brief. There have been other hugs over the years. After winning the TB State Championship there were several hugs shared... Senior night in high school is also another good example. Things that I really never thought about at the time, but would think twice about in 2021.
 

sluggers

Super Moderator
Staff member
May 26, 2008
7,132
113
Dallas, Texas
Pardon there sluggers, never mind when people share there opinion,,, but your opinion cannot and does not invalidate success others already do accomplish.

Pardon there @RADcatcher, never mind when people share there opinion, but your opinion cannot and does not invalidate success others already do accomplish.

The preference would be for the child to do it himself or herself based on verbal instruction.

However, it doesn't always work that way. Some kids are hopelessly clueless about how to hold a bat. (The usual case is the kid standing straight legged with the bat resting on his/her shoulder, often with their hands overlapping.)

Additionally, a mentally or physically handicapped child may not be able to follow verbal instructions.

The coach should limit the amount of physical contact to only what is necessary. And, the coach should maintain as much space as possible between the player and the coach.

Here are some articles which you might want to read:



 
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radness

Possibilities & Opportunities!
Dec 13, 2019
7,270
113
@sluggers~
Never did i attempt at all to invalidate someones opinion.

I expressed success not be invalidated by opinion.

Your post replying to mine said it is impossible to teach young kids without touching some of them.
I have found success without having to.

Learning how to teach/instruct/coach without handling players is possible too!
 
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Mar 6, 2016
383
63
Couple years ago..10u All Stars, we had a game we were down 1 with 2 outs in bottom of last inning, girls on 2nd and 3rd.... and the girl up had maybe 1 hit all All Star season. She was struggling big time and lost all her confidence.

She got a called first strike...no movement..statue...then a ball. close, but a ball... something inside me told me to call time and talk to her. I told her she is going to win the game right here, right now. Trust herself, give yourself the chance, its going to happen, YOU will win the game for us right here. She gave a sheepish, not so sure smile and back to the box.

Very next pitch she swung and hit a flare, wounded duck down RF line that dropped and both runners scored to win the game.

I was sooo happy for the kid and I ran over to her like we just won the world series and lifted her up high above my head and congratulated her on winning the game for the team. She was grinning from ear to ear and then all the girls celebrated with her.

I wouldn't do anything different to this day. Her parents could not be more thankful to me after that game for doing that for their daughter.
 
Jul 16, 2013
4,659
113
Pennsylvania
This is seperate point i made earlier that went undiscussed.


This developmental reason to not handle and manipulate what somebody else is doing with their body~
is for them to learn how to make that connection by using their own brain!!!

To use communication by listening, asking and applying direction to their own body.

Could say its part of learning to be coachable.
____________________
Heres the elephant in the room bottom line (maybe ;) )
This topic wouldnt need to be discussed if people used better judgement of their own actions.
Until that happens~
There will probably be more posts like the op's one!!!

I see it as a matter of better judgement combined with a lack of trust.

Some people will see a male coach move a young hitter's hands during a hitting drill and automatically assume that the coach has other motives behind his actions. This is a wild stereotype that was caused by a very small percentage of the population that actually does have other motives. I cannot fault people that have been through difficult situations wanting to keep their children safe. We all want to keep our children safe.

As a result, coaches need to assume that any/every action they make could result in accusations and/or lawsuits. This again is a wild stereotype that was caused by a very small percentage of the population that mischaracterizes intentions. I cannot fault coaches from wanting to avoid such accusations, etc.
 

radness

Possibilities & Opportunities!
Dec 13, 2019
7,270
113
I see it as a matter of better judgement combined with a lack of trust.

Some people will see a male coach move a young hitter's hands during a hitting drill and automatically assume that the coach has other motives behind his actions. This is a wild stereotype that was caused by a very small percentage of the population that actually does have other motives. I cannot fault people that have been through difficult situations wanting to keep their children safe. We all want to keep our children safe.

As a result, coaches need to assume that any/every action they make could result in accusations and/or lawsuits. This again is a wild stereotype that was caused by a very small percentage of the population that mischaracterizes intentions. I cannot fault coaches from wanting to avoid such accusations, etc.
its nice to read broader thoughts like this.

as I read and re-read through some of these posts it occurred to me ...
wonder what percentage of travel ball coaches, simply by their 'interactive demeanor' would not be allowed to coach at a Collegiate level ... Or even at high school level.
Those actually have guidelines they implement. College coaching there's definitely a line drawn...no touch.
Unfortunately that still does get crossed but there is still more of a line. Obviously a line drawn by a paycheck and employment.

What % travel coaches behavior would not be allowed in college?
 
Feb 20, 2020
377
63
While we all regret some of these changes in expectations and behavior, let's not overlook the reason. Studies show that somewhere between 2 and 10 percent of female athletes have reported being sexually abused by a coach. While it's a small percentage, it's not a small number of girls. The last numbers I could find (2012) say that 1.2 million girls play softball. Even at the lowest percentage -- 2 -- that still means 24,000 girls. Or you can think of it this way -- at a 60 team tournament, statistics would suggest that 15 girls are being abused. Or, if you're in a four team pool, statistically one of the girls has been/is being abused.

In other words, the numbers are just too big to ignore red flags.

The OP posted a specific event, and this thread turned into a much bigger debate, and I think there's probably a big difference between touching someone to put them in position and abusing them. But I'd remind you that everyone thought that Nassar's "examinations" were perfectly copacetic, too. So as quickly as many want to dismiss the idea entirely, don't overlook that a) it is a real problem and b) things that have been perceived as perfectly innocent at times haven't been. Preventing things like that is, to me, more important than nostalgia or even demonstrating correct form.
 
Dec 11, 2010
4,713
113
As a coach, I just never want to put myself in a position that could be misinterpreted. I never want to people to even wonder.

Many coaches are very good are warm, huggy people and they just have a persona that no one doubts. They are genuine. No one doubts their motivations. Still, I am personally not comfortable with that and I’m very conscious of avoid any situation that could even give the suggestion of impropriety. Even a false accusation is damaging.

Just because a coach physically touches a player appropriately in an appropriate setting does not bother me at all. Yet I can’t remember doing it and I really don’t want to. It’s just not me.

I also haven’t coached really young kids in a long time. I can see how it is harder to verbally direct and demonstrate to them to the position you want them to be in.

I am always glad to see this topic discussed. I am glad that people are aware that there are people out there that you need to be careful of. I’m glad that coaches are thinking about how their actions can be perceived and that they are thinking of how they can avoid putting themselves in bad positions.
 
Jun 8, 2016
16,118
113
If I end up in jail for moving a kid's hands then I will just consider that retribution for all the other (actual) crappy things I have done....nobody will be any worse for the wear.
 
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