Crow hopping

[4KidsDad]

My point is that everything prior to the crow hop must be legal in order for the crow hop to be called as an IP. In the absence of a legal drag the crow hop is moot. Consider Barnhill, I have yet to see her not leap and then crow hop. If she has already committed an IP by leaping the crow hop is moot.

Cool. Got it now.

 

[WVSteven]

If there is no drag, it is not a crow hop, it's a Leap, which is also illegal. A crow hop, by definition includes a drag.

I keep seeing this type of comment and it's not entirely true:
A leap is when both feet are airborne at the same time.
A crow hop is when the pivot foot replants and provides a new impetus for the pitch (a closer place to push off for the delivery).
If the pitcher goes airborne with both feet, replants the pivot foot and then pushes off from there then you have a crow hop. If she does not push off again then the infractions is a leap.
The replant can follow a step forward by the pivot foot (which is also illegal), a legal drag followed by a replant, or a leap. It is called a crow HOP for a reason.

What I, as umpires am looking for:
1. Did the foot stay in contact with the dirt?
2. If her foot was not in contact with the dirt is there a hole that prevents her from dragging? (point your toe down and let me know you're trying and I'm more lenient on this one)
3. If she replanted was it clear and obvious? (When in doubt it's a no-call)

You do not have to like it but the crow hop is probably the most often missed illegal pitch. There are many factors that must be processed in the time it takes to make the step (replant if guilty). We err on the side of a no-call, at least in high school/USA, and let coaches know at times, "she's getting pretty close". But I have to be 100% before I'm going to call that because it's not usually something she can fix within the game.

 

[Rolling Hard]

I keep seeing this type of comment and it's not entirely true:
A leap is when both feet are airborne at the same time.
A crow hop is when the pivot foot replants and provides a new impetus for the pitch (a closer place to push off for the delivery).
If the pitcher goes airborne with both feet, replants the pivot foot and then pushes off from there then you have a crow hop. If she does not push off again then the infractions is a leap.
The replant can follow a step forward by the pivot foot (which is also illegal), a legal drag followed by a replant, or a leap. It is called a crow HOP for a reason.

What I, as umpires am looking for:
1. Did the foot stay in contact with the dirt?
2. If her foot was not in contact with the dirt is there a hole that prevents her from dragging? (point your toe down and let me know you're trying and I'm more lenient on this one)
3. If she replanted was it clear and obvious? (When in doubt it's a no-call)

You do not have to like it but the crow hop is probably the most often missed illegal pitch. There are many factors that must be processed in the time it takes to make the step (replant if guilty). We err on the side of a no-call, at least in high school/USA, and let coaches know at times, "she's getting pretty close". But I have to be 100% before I'm going to call that because it's not usually something she can fix within the game.

When you watch Barnhill from different slo mo angles do you believe or is it your judgement that she throws an IP close to 100% of the time?

 

[Lozza]

Again you’re all arguing over something that isn’t happening. Barnhill doesn’t crow hop. Neither does Plain.

Once Kelly is out of NCAA play her pitching motion becomes legal. Because I’m international play leaping is legal. (And that’s why Plain leaps because it’s been legal her entire pitching life. She’s spoken a ton length about having to change her motion to pitch in NCAA tho it doesn’t always work)

 

[chinamigarden]

Then I concede you are a bigger man than me! I'm assuming you're a man....

If you get the opportunity, I would pay airfare and expenses to watch that game where you would be single-handedly responsible for causing the crow-hopping pitcher to leave the game.

The first IP will likely get no repercussion. The 2nd in a row, you'll have the coach asking what you're calling. The 3rd in a row, you'll have the offending pitcher's crowd starting to grumble. The 4th in a row, you'll have the entire crowd starting to jaw. The 5th in a row, you'll have the coach in your face very upset and the pitcher will probably start breaking down in tears. The 6th, I guess the coach will have to remove the pitcher.

Of course, the scenario above is just guessing what would happen after the 2nd IP in a row because I've never gotten past that point!

its happened in the WCWS. Not sooner which would probably keep the problem from being called in the biggest amateur tourney of the year.

 

[chinamigarden]

There is a clear advantage to leaving the base early. The earlier you leave the better faster you will get to the next base.

With illegal pitching, in my opinion, there is little if any advantage gained. Others claim you are getting more "X" miles per hour but I haven't seen that evidence with my radar gun or any research.

Yes but if you replant and push again, and release the pitch 2 or 3 feet closer to the batter, the reaction time is still faster whether the pitch is faster or not.

 

[WVSteven]

When you watch Barnhill from different slo mo angles do you believe or is it your judgement that she throws an IP close to 100% of the time?

I've yelled at the tv several times, "She's replanting!" but the SEC umpires can't hear me . It's easier to see with the close angles on cameras. It's a different discussion when you have so many different things to watch during the game on the field. They do not have slow motion replay. At this point in time it would take some courage to call since she's done it for so long.

 

[texasheat]

At this point in time it would take some courage to call since she's done it for so long.

Yep, which is why they all just collect their $$$ and go home to momma without calling it. Why make a scene if it doesn't affect your paycheck? Not worth it. The Ump is getting paid the same amount whether he calls it or he doesn't. The path of least resistance is to let it go like all the other umps before him have. So we end up where we are now. Watching illegal pitches left and right with nothing done about it.

 

[djcarter1966]

Again you’re all arguing over something that isn’t happening. Barnhill doesn’t crow hop. Neither does Plain.

Once Kelly is out of NCAA play her pitching motion becomes legal. Because I’m international play leaping is legal. (And that’s why Plain leaps because it’s been legal her entire pitching life. She’s spoken a ton length about having to change her motion to pitch in NCAA tho it doesn’t always work)

Really? Barnhill does at times not leap but drag and replant only; at least that is all you would notice without super slow mo and blowing up the video which if it takes that level of scrutiny I would say should not be called; what is 100% not in doubt is that she replants her pivot foot and reestablishes a new point from which to push off, per the NCAA definition that is a crop hop and illegal.

 

[Gtrips07]

There is a clear advantage to leaving the base early. The earlier you leave the better faster you will get to the next base.

With illegal pitching, in my opinion, there is little if any advantage gained. Others claim you are getting more "X" miles per hour but I haven't seen that evidence with my radar gun or any research.

Barnhill throws at a different velocity when she leaps. I have gunned her myself on several occasions from right behind home plate. At least 3-4 mph difference

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