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Ball ON glove, not IN the glove still an out?

Sep 9, 2019
19
3
In most cases it could be really hard to say the hand holding the ball made no contact. Does it have to be the hand holding the ball? The wrist, lower arm count? Touch of gray here and hard to call safe if a good tag is applied.
 
Aug 1, 2019
121
28
South Carolina
Good reply, thank you. Now a slightly different take from those of you in blue. While you should and will uphold the rule, what do you think of it. Is this a rule that should be reviewed and possibly altered by the great umping powers that be? I'm always interested in how umpires explain rules. Here I'd love to learn if you like this rule. And why or why not.
Honestly, to me, it's a non-issue. I can't recall in my 20+ years of umpiring where I've ever seen a fielder tag a runner with an empty glove while the ball was pinned against the back of it. I've seen plenty of times where the fielder reaches with an empty glove to tag a runner while holding the ball well separated in the other hand. In the cases where I have seen a two-handed tag, the fielder is always holding the ball with the bare hand inside the glove, or it appears that way to me.

The thing you have to be concerned with when the fielder is holding the ball against the glove is this: at the time the empty glove makes contact with the runner, was the ball still touching the glove? Or was the fielder already in the process of separating the ball from the glove so that she can make a hurried throw to play on another runner? Why make this more difficult on the umpire to judge? It's simpler and cleaner to see that the ball was in the glove when the runner was tagged with it. Maybe that's why the rule is written the way it is.

So to answer your question, I like the rule as it is. I don't think it needs to change to allow the empty-glove tag as long as the ball is touching the back of it.
 
Aug 1, 2019
121
28
South Carolina
In most cases it could be really hard to say the hand holding the ball made no contact. Does it have to be the hand holding the ball?
Yes
The wrist, lower arm count?
No.

Now, good luck noticing that the fielder touched the runner only with the wrist, while no part of the hand touched the runner. That's really splitting hairs. But the rule is the rule, and if you can actually see that a fielder used only her wrist to touch the runner, you don't have a legal tag.
 
Sep 9, 2019
19
3
Yes

No.

Now, good luck noticing that the fielder touched the runner only with the wrist, while no part of the hand touched the runner. That's really splitting hairs. But the rule is the rule, and if you can actually see that a fielder used only her wrist to touch the runner, you don't have a legal tag.
Yeah that's the point. It would likely be difficult to call them safe.
 
Aug 1, 2019
121
28
South Carolina
I think it’s funny that rule has to follow every letter of the law until someone brings up where is the top of the strike zone.
I'm not sure I catch your drift. The strike zone is defined in the rules of every sanction out there. Umpires are required to use it. So yeah, they should follow every letter of that law as well. Whether they do or not is usually a matter of judgment.

Now, if you have an umpire who knows the top of the zone per the book but flat-out refuses to enforce it because they feel it's too high, shame on them.
 
May 29, 2015
1,051
113
I’m BU for a middle school game. Throw from the catcher to third base to try to get a runner going back. F5 was slightly up the baseline and the runner is almost parallel to her. The throw is over the runner’s head and F5 reaches out and snags the throw, bringing her forearm down on the runner’s helmet after she catches the ball. SAFE! Not that hard to make that call.

Then there was the Kyle Schwarber slide in the Cubs/Cards game in September. Although, I still think that umpire got it right out of luck ...


Well that's different and you know it. The difference is...uhhhh... Hey Blue, a little help here
Here’s how it’s different: we aren’t discussing balls and strikes coach. ;)
 
Feb 3, 2016
247
28
I'd never challenge it if an umpire call my player out with a tag as described. Ball in hand in glove ETC..

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