Avulsion fracture in pelvis

[bellaboomomma]

Thank you so much for your offer to help. That is my biggest concern after she takes the time off, how do we prevent it from happening again.
She’s not all that flexible and she has extremely tight muscles and tendons so I’m sure that along with not stretching enough has alot to do with it.

Here are a few videos of different angles and a slo-mo so you can see. The first couple videos were from Dec/Jan and the last one was from last week. Her speed dropped considerably in my opinion due to the pain and not using her legs hardly at all.

Now I already know a few things on her mechanics that need to be fixed/we are working on....her glove arm swimming like crazy. She used to be fairly good at the arm whip when she was seeing Bill Hillhouse before we moved(Hi Bill!!), but she has since started to lose it a bit and I’m sure the glove arm doesn’t help with that.

Anything else you could add would be fantastic! I definitely want to try to fix some of her mechanics that could have contributed to this injury and others in the future.

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[bellaboomomma]

We also got our 2nd opinion today and it was good news! She does not actually have an Avulsion fracture, just apophysitis(inflammation) of the pelvis which we basically were told is an overuse injury. She still obviously needs time off but it looks more promising than the first diagnosis. She’s already driving me crazy not being able to do anything and it hasn’t even been a week yet!! Thank you all for the well wishes!!

 

[DrRiello]

We also got our 2nd opinion today and it was good news! She does not actually have an Avulsion fracture, just apophysitis(inflammation) of the pelvis which we basically were told is an overuse injury. She still obviously needs time off but it looks more promising than the first diagnosis. She’s already driving me crazy not being able to do anything and it hasn’t even been a week yet!! Thank you all for the well wishes!!

Well that’s amazing news. You went from nothing for 6 weeks to being mobile and having the ability to do something’s. Congrats.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[javasource]

That's great news!!!

Again... not a doctor... might only be worth what you're paying for it!

The Monica drill... I would kill that for awhile (truthfully... permanently). Even though the second opinion has come back with a non-tear diagnosis... there is no doubt a monstrous strain happening in her hip region. Given that she has range of motion limitations in that region (tight)... the last thing you want to do... is start her out with a huge amount of hip flexion in the drive leg... with her legs so far apart... and then ask her to violently work out of an frightful amount of hip flexion into extension. Whether the area of concern is the rectoris femoris, or say the sartorius muscle... both are negatively responding to rapid extension... and would only be worse over a greater range of motion.

I would also recommend that you start getting her out of that forward lean when releasing the ball... as it's also adding a little to the extension throughout the left hip... and is just murder on the young ladies hips & spine, in general... not to mention a huge speed loss.

One note about a couple things you mentioned in the previous message... regarding stretches...

There is no doubt a benefit in doing these kinds of things... HOWEVER... they should only be used as part of a flexibility development and maintenance program... COMPLETELY removed from PRECEDING dynamic training or competition. IOW, do these on different days... and ONLY WITH A TRAINED EYE. When I watch adults require that kids statically stretch prior to games, activity, and the like... my head explodes. Not only is this a terrible idea prior to performance... but they allow kids to do them with ZERO accuracy in posture and no emphasis/correction on form.

Also, you're DD is trying to get open. Given the tightness of her hams, flexors, etc... this is a really, really bad idea, for so many reasons I won't begin to bore you all to death.

Try this: stand on the rubber (you, not her) and take a long step forward with your non-dominant leg (if you're a lefty, too... take a step forward with the right leg and vice versa). Keep your toes pointing toward home plate as you step. When your foot comes down, hold that position. Look at your hips... and notice how they started OPENING NATURALLY... as a response to your feet getting further apart. The degree to which you hips will do so.. greatly depends on your hip mobility... a completely NATURAL body response.

By instructing a player to get open... the hips turn, and this allows for the legs to separate even further... but it also puts the hips/butt in a position where it disconnects from the shoulders (butt out). What we end up with is a complete disconnection and... I'll say it... a dangerous position to put a kid in as their one leg gets caught behind... and the other leg deals with forces 2X their body weight. Because of the pelvic displacement (in relationship to the upper torso)... the shock of those ground forces shoots straight to the hip region... and they end up doing tissue damage over time. If you figure in that much shock to the region... with the legs in a completely non-ideal position... you can imagine how much pelvic strain these kids are having to deal with.

There's a reference in a recent post that shows ideal body organization at foot plant (gif of Monica)... take a look at that and compare it to your DD's videos.

Blah... too much typing for a cell phone... hope this is legible! So glad to hear she's not far away from a return... but start to look at her body organization, and kill that kneeling drill!

Best,
~JS

 

[bellaboomomma]

That's great news!!!

Again... not a doctor... might only be worth what you're paying for it!

The Monica drill... I would kill that for awhile (truthfully... permanently). Even though the second opinion has come back with a non-tear diagnosis... there is no doubt a monstrous strain happening in her hip region. Given that she has range of motion limitations in that region (tight)... the last thing you want to do... is start her out with a huge amount of hip flexion in the drive leg... with her legs so far apart... and then ask her to violently work out of an frightful amount of hip flexion into extension. Whether the area of concern is the rectoris femoris, or say the sartorius muscle... both are negatively responding to rapid extension... and would only be worse over a greater range of motion.

I would also recommend that you start getting her out of that forward lean when releasing the ball... as it's also adding a little to the extension throughout the left hip... and is just murder on the young ladies hips & spine, in general... not to mention a huge speed loss.

One note about a couple things you mentioned in the previous message... regarding stretches...

There is no doubt a benefit in doing these kinds of things... HOWEVER... they should only be used as part of a flexibility development and maintenance program... COMPLETELY removed from PRECEDING dynamic training or competition. IOW, do these on different days... and ONLY WITH A TRAINED EYE. When I watch adults require that kids statically stretch prior to games, activity, and the like... my head explodes. Not only is this a terrible idea prior to performance... but they allow kids to do them with ZERO accuracy in posture and no emphasis/correction on form.

Also, you're DD is trying to get open. Given the tightness of her hams, flexors, etc... this is a really, really bad idea, for so many reasons I won't begin to bore you all to death.

Try this: stand on the rubber (you, not her) and take a long step forward with your non-dominant leg (if you're a lefty, too... take a step forward with the right leg and vice versa). Keep your toes pointing toward home plate as you step. When your foot comes down, hold that position. Look at your hips... and notice how they started OPENING NATURALLY... as a response to your feet getting further apart. The degree to which you hips will do so.. greatly depends on your hip mobility... a completely NATURAL body response.

By instructing a player to get open... the hips turn, and this allows for the legs to separate even further... but it also puts the hips/butt in a position where it disconnects from the shoulders (butt out). What we end up with is a complete disconnection and... I'll say it... a dangerous position to put a kid in as their one leg gets caught behind... and the other leg deals with forces 2X their body weight. Because of the pelvic displacement (in relationship to the upper torso)... the shock of those ground forces shoots straight to the hip region... and they end up doing tissue damage over time. If you figure in that much shock to the region... with the legs in a completely non-ideal position... you can imagine how much pelvic strain these kids are having to deal with.

There's a reference in a recent post that shows ideal body organization at foot plant (gif of Monica)... take a look at that and compare it to your DD's videos.

Blah... too much typing for a cell phone... hope this is legible! So glad to hear she's not far away from a return... but start to look at her body organization, and kill that kneeling drill!

Best,
~JS

Thank you for the input! Yes, the lean has gotten much much better but it’s definitely something she is also working on still for sure.

I have a couple of questions though that maybe you can clarify....regarding the getting open, is that not what she should be doing to avoid pitching HE? I’m trying to understand how to do the arm whip without being open and not throwing the ball towards 3rd base instead of home plate lol I definitely understand what you are saying regarding it being hard on those muscles etc, but I haven’t ever had anybody say to not try to get open. Also on the stride....I’ve always thought she actually had a really short stride compared to many of the other pitchers and I just chalked it up to her flexibility and hadn’t really ever tried to get her to go much farther due to the lack of flexibility. So should she just be “stepping” off the rubber?

I know you know what you are talking about and what you are doing, so please forgive me as I’m just trying to understand how to still have the power without doing the things you mentioned could cause her further injury. Clearly I don’t want her to injure herself, I’m just trying to grasp how to get speed without really using the legs and power drills like we’ve always been told to do.

I appreciate you taking the time to give your expert feedback!!

 

[javasource]

....regarding the getting open, is that not what she should be doing to avoid pitching HE?

Not sure I know how to answer this... wasn't aware that getting open eliminates H/E... I always thought it made it worse. In fact, I'm pretty sure it's the main building block of H/E.

"Open the hips, get hand on top of ball, clear a lane, snap the elbow, and finish elbow high".

(Not my words... that author shall remain anonymous...)

I’m trying to understand how to do the arm whip without being open...

Right... you guys went to Bill... I totally forgot. That's his thing. If you were around 3 or 4 years ago... we all concluded here that getting open causes blindness... Hi BILL! LOL

...and not throwing the ball towards 3rd base instead of home plate lol I definitely understand what you are saying regarding it being hard on those muscles etc, but I haven’t ever had anybody say to not try to get open.

We tend to shock a lot of people with our statements around here. I'm not suggesting, nor have I that you stay closed... but that you don't ADD TO the natural opening process that happens when you separate your feet while driving/striding.

Did you do the "Try this..." recommendation? Did your hips open NATURALLY? When they did... was your belly button facing 3rd base? I'm hoping the answers were: Yes, Yes, No.

"Open" is a relative term. It's always in reference to a door. So when someone says the door is "closed"... it's shut. If it's not shut... it's open... how much, is the issue here. "Open" is also an instruction in pitching. IT SHOULD NOT BE. What the "Try this..." thing illustrates is that our body will open naturally... and no one EVER needs to open as much as your DD.

This is LETTING open happen:

This is MAKING open happen:

Also on the stride....I’ve always thought she actually had a really short stride compared to many of the other pitchers and I just chalked it up to her flexibility and hadn’t really ever tried to get her to go much farther due to the lack of flexibility. So should she just be “stepping” off the rubber?

Stepping off the rubber? Did Bill put you up to these questions? Sounds like he's just trying to have fun with me.

I might be the least "stepping" person you'll ever meet... there's some decent non-stepping drills in the DM sticky... 2-Step, Pushback, Jumpback, STFG, etc... that all deal with getting a kid off the rubber explosively.

I wrote:

By instructing a player to get open... the hips turn, and this allows for the legs to separate even further... but it also puts the hips/butt in a position where it disconnects from the shoulders (butt out). What we end up with is a complete disconnection and... I'll say it... a dangerous position to put a kid in as their one leg gets caught behind... and the other leg deals with forces 2X their body weight. Because of the pelvic displacement (in relationship to the upper torso)... the shock of those ground forces shoots straight to the hip region... and they end up doing tissue damage over time. If you figure in that much shock to the region... with the legs in a completely non-ideal position... you can imagine how much pelvic strain these kids are having to deal with.

I know you know what you are talking about and what you are doing, so please forgive me as I’m just trying to understand how to still have the power without doing the things you mentioned could cause her further injury. Clearly I don’t want her to injure herself, I’m just trying to grasp how to get speed without really using the legs and power drills like we’ve always been told to do.

I appreciate you taking the time to give your expert feedback!!

No need to butter me up... just trying to help.