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Arm finish

Jun 20, 2008
10
0
Boise, Idaho
I teach girls to snap hard at the bottom of their pitch and the allow the arm to flow its natural direction in order to dissipate the energy without causing harm. Invariably the arm finishes accross the body and the wrist almost alays turns over to show fingers down and back of hand. The elbow may be bent but often is not. This is the same technique advocated by Doug Gillis who I think is a fabulous pitching instructor.
All pitches can be taught with this follow through, and NONE of my pitchers (about 150 over my 18 years) have ever had a sore shoulder from this. I have spoken with chiropractors as well, and they also concurr. The final piece of evidence was watching the US olympic pitchers. Jenny, Monica, and Cat all use the natural follow-thru.
So Why do so many pitching coaches still FORCE their clients to finish straight up with their arm...especially when almost every one of them has chronic shoulder pain????
 

halskinner

Banned
May 7, 2008
2,689
0
I teach girls to snap hard at the bottom of their pitch and the allow the arm to flow its natural direction in order to dissipate the energy without causing harm. Invariably the arm finishes accross the body and the wrist almost alays turns over to show fingers down and back of hand. The elbow may be bent but often is not. This is the same technique advocated by Doug Gillis who I think is a fabulous pitching instructor.
Invariably the arm finishes accross the body and the wrist almost alays turns over to show fingers down and back of hand. The elbow may be bent but often is not. This is the same technique advocated by Doug Gillis who I think is a fabulous pitching instructor. I have spoken with chiropractors as well, and they also concurr. The final piece of evidence was watching the US olympic pitchers. Jenny, Monica, and Cat all use the natural follow-thru.
So Why do so many pitching coaches still FORCE their clients to finish straight up with their arm...especially when almost every one of them has chronic shoulder pain????
OK. I guess I will go first and I have no choice bit to get nit-picky.

"I teach girls to snap hard at the bottom of their pitch and the allow the arm to flow its natural direction in order to dissipate the energy without causing harm."

Which pitches are you talking about? I have to assume you think EVERY pitch should be thrown as absolutely hard as possible? What about the other pitches? The off-speed and slow change ups? Again, I have to assume you expect every pitch to be released at the 6:00 position? What about pitches that have a different release point, like just in front of the front leg? I know several pitches that have that release point.

"Invariably the arm finishes accross the body and the wrist almost alays turns over to show fingers down and back of hand. "

This will depend on the particular pitch being thrown

"The elbow may be bent but often is not. This is the same technique advocated by Doug Gillis who I think is a fabulous pitching instructor. "

If that elbow is NOT bent, the pitcher is using unsafe mechanics, Doug can tell you that.

I had the pleasure of meeting Doug a couple years ago and watching him pitch a game. I do not recall him using what you describe when pitching himself, at least not in that game. Maybe Doug can come on here and clarify this.

"I have spoken with chiropractors as well, and they also concurr."

"Concur with what?"

"The final piece of evidence was watching the US olympic pitchers. Jenny, Monica, and Cat all use the natural follow-thru."

Did it ever occur to you that maybe they use that follow through on some pitches but add that follow through to other pitches to try and help deceive that particular batter? Something they can do after release to make one pitch look more like that last when it is not? This is something I did as a pitcher, especially with the palmball drop.

"So Why do so many pitching coaches still FORCE their clients to finish straight up with their arm...especially when almost every one of them has chronic shoulder pain????"

OK. Now you are going to have to site some cases here. I too do NOT advocate a follow through that brings the hand up to the shoulder. Not because it is a strain on the shoulder, because it IS quite stressful to the elbow. I take it you have an instructor in your area that requires their students to do this and they have sore shoulders? If they have sore shoulders I strongly expect it is from something else in their mechanics that is not right.

Winning Fast Pitch Softball
 
Jun 20, 2008
10
0
Boise, Idaho
Sorry

Hal,
Guess I was not very specific about my rant. I have had to deal with instructors in my area that literally force kids to finish straight up to or actually behind their throwing shoulder and I was referring only to the fastball, sorry about that confusion.
As far as Doug goes, I agree that the arm should finish bent (if only slightly) and loose, but as I said, some people force kids to bend at the elbow, as much as 90 degrees.
The Chiropractor thing was about allowing pitchers to finish with a natural follow through rather than, again forcing the arm straight up on the throwing side.
I was ranting because I am in an area where this is prevelent and I just moved here from Tucson...didn't you understand what I was thinking rather than what I said...?...LOL
Peace
Steg
 

halskinner

Banned
May 7, 2008
2,689
0
Hal,
Guess I was not very specific about my rant. I have had to deal with instructors in my area that literally force kids to finish straight up to or actually behind their throwing shoulder and I was referring only to the fastball, sorry about that confusion.
As far as Doug goes, I agree that the arm should finish bent (if only slightly) and loose, but as I said, some people force kids to bend at the elbow, as much as 90 degrees.
The Chiropractor thing was about allowing pitchers to finish with a natural follow through rather than, again forcing the arm straight up on the throwing side.
I was ranting because I am in an area where this is prevelent and I just moved here from Tucson...didn't you understand what I was thinking rather than what I said...?...LOL
Peace
Steg

There is one in my area that still teaches the deep "forward dip", from what I am told. I know a few former pitchers that this movement killed their pitching career and a few got taken out of sports completely from lower back injuries.

When I was still instructing, every once in awhile I would get one of her former students. The first thing I have them do is pitch like they do right now. I would see that forward dip on the 1st and 2nd pitch and then everything came to a stop. I would usually spend the rest of that session explaining why that forward dip had to stop. If they would agree to stop doing that, we would continue. If not, I refused to work with the student because I wanted no part of her injuring her back.

I know the frustration you are talking about, trust me.

As far as bringing the hand up to the shoulder in the follow through, I saw very few pitchers that had what I would consider 'Good' accuracy that used that follow through.

The release point has to be so exactly accurate it is difficult.

By the way, that 'release of energy' you speak of in the follow through; I proved many years ago that it can be accomplished in just a few inches of travel, in a straight forward motion. It's a case of touching the brakes vs slamming on the brakes. They simply have to be taught how to control their brakes. AND, they have to have a slight bend in the elbow.

Catch ya later.

Hal

Winning Fast Pitch Softball
 
Jul 14, 2008
1,723
38
FYI, you are right on track......Not withstanding any "nit-picking", keep up the good work........

See this post:

Follow Though Inplications.........

I teach girls to snap hard at the bottom of their pitch and the allow the arm to flow its natural direction in order to dissipate the energy without causing harm. Invariably the arm finishes accross the body and the wrist almost alays turns over to show fingers down and back of hand. The elbow may be bent but often is not. This is the same technique advocated by Doug Gillis who I think is a fabulous pitching instructor.
All pitches can be taught with this follow through, and NONE of my pitchers (about 150 over my 18 years) have ever had a sore shoulder from this. I have spoken with chiropractors as well, and they also concurr. The final piece of evidence was watching the US olympic pitchers. Jenny, Monica, and Cat all use the natural follow-thru.
So Why do so many pitching coaches still FORCE their clients to finish straight up with their arm...especially when almost every one of them has chronic shoulder pain????
 
Aug 2, 2008
553
0
My daughter has been pitching for 1 year 3 months, she is 10 now. We are still trying to master the correct mechanics of throwing a fastball. She has a good pitching coach, his teachings seem to fit all of the good advice I find here and other places on the net. But for the moment please dumb it down for me, Explain where her hand should be from 12 o'clock to 6 o'clock, should she lead with her elbow to create whip? how she should be releasing the ball for max. velocity, and follow through advice. She is doing better at creating a strong front side, this stuff is hard to explain to a 10 year old, so right now simple seems to be better.

Thanks,
Mike
 

Ken Krause

Administrator
Admin
May 7, 2008
3,461
48
Mundelein, IL
I have heard pitchers say they were taught to make that movement so they would "follow through." They were stopping their arm or hand at their side so they were told to touch their shoulder with their hands.

Unfortunately, you're just trading one problem for another -- and a more dangerous one. Stopping the arm at the side rather than completing follow-through will likely hinder your development as a pitcher. But as Hal says, pulling your hand up and touching your shoulder will likely hurt your elbow, and you won't be pitching anymore.

Follow-throughs need to be loose and natural. As long as what they're doing is safe and effective, I pretty much let them do what they want. They find what works best for them. But I don't let them do the shoulder touch thing, since it's not natural.
 

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