Any miracles? Hitting hip: good pitcher to poor pitcher in 2 weeks

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Apr 5, 2009
748
28
NE Kansas
If I was to attach a hula hoop representing a natural arm circle to this girl based on that hip/shoulder alignment, the circle would carry the ball to the rh side. Hence my question. The arm circle with stretch does not run parallel with the frontal plane of the body even though you can forcibly swing it that way. I would say she is getting too sideways to her target and trying to make her arm go where mother nature doesn't really want it to go. Make an arm circle to the target and then find where your hip/shoulder angles facilitate that arm circle when weightless.

Momentum going left is another animal which further mixes up the soup.


If you make that left foot work a lot harder on the initial drive it won't be crossing over in front of right foot. Currently she is swinging her body over sideways to help line things up for her right leg to drive "everything" forward. Additionally she is not weightless until the ball is overhead which screws with the body turning to facilitate the arm circle.

2 step - lots of quality 2 step. Embrace drive mechanics.
 
Last edited:
Dec 16, 2010
172
18
My 12 y/o DD has been hitting her hip consistently the past two weeks rendering her almost un-pitchable. Her coach that we've worked with was unable to see anything wrong with her arm path in videos. Yesterday, I was able to get video of her actually hitting her hip with her forearm. She's hitting her hip bone pinky side about 3" down from her elbow. We've had an x-ray and has been looked at by 2 doctors to rule out a serious injury. all signs point to a deep muscle bruise.
Now, she's unable to pitch more than 10 balls without hitting at least once and it ruins her. She's gone from a good pitcher to a girl who can't pitch. ANY ideas or things to try would be greatly appreciated.

Hope these work....

Here she is actually hitting her hip. You can see the difference in her arm speed now that she's hitting. :(


here are a few videos of normal pitching...





Any thoughts on how to fix her new issue?
Thanks in advance!
Sincerely,
Ross Signorino


Been there with 2 daughters. Can't promise the same results for you but this worked like a miracle for my daughters:

The fast way to get the timing right is for your daughter to practice pitching the ball into her own glove. I believe you'll both find that she can achieve good I/R and brush interference without hitting her forearm on her hip doing this. Use either the javasource or Balswick videos for the technique.

Then, carry this timing to full pitching. In addition to letting her arm heal, focusing on the posture/timing/technique demonstrated in the videos should almost immediately improve your dd's speed and control--at least it did mine.

You can throw a lot of pitches into your own glove in 5 minutes so slow down and focus on the technique/timing.

Good luck.
 

h8weakness

Bucket Dad
Jan 9, 2019
35
8
Mishawaka, IN
Well... came out today not hitting her hip. 🤷‍♂️ I don't get it. I'll so confused. Thank you all for your help. There's so much to change and perfect. You guys are awesome.
Sincerely,
Dumb dad on a bucket
 

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sluggers

Super Moderator
Staff member
May 26, 2008
7,133
113
Dallas, Texas
Well... came out today not hitting her hip. 🤷‍♂️ I don't get it. I'll so confused. Thank you all for your help. There's so much to change and perfect. You guys are awesome.
Sincerely,
Dumb dad on a bucket

Here is my take...

A kid until around 12 or 13 doesn't really need good mechanics to be a "good" pitcher. Kind of crazy, but 12U and lower level 14U, all the pitcher has to do is put over the plate at 50MPH and she is touted as the next coming of Lisa Fernandez.

At some point, the kid's body starts changing into her adult body. Any flaws in form start wreaking havoc on the kid's pitching.

Brush interference (her arm brushing her side) is critical for control. If she does not have brush interference, she is going to be incredibly inconsistent.
 
Last edited:
Sep 29, 2014
2,421
113
Good to hear...i would have her work on drive mechanics though. Use the power line you have painted there...just show her the video and explain anything not going straight forward is a flaw her body will start compensating for which will mess with a bunch of other things. She doesn't even need to pitch a ball she can do this empty handed but make sure she still goes through the motions. her foot should be hitting the power line assuming she starts on the line at about a 45 degree angle it doesn't have to be exact we just don't want her toe pointing at third base.
 
Feb 3, 2010
5,752
113
Pac NW
Checking in to see how things are going? Her posture and leg orientation were key factors in the bone on bone contact. Try this: stand in the release position, but with the drag leg straight and the heel touching the ground like this:

14536

Let the arm hang by the side and you should find that the arm has significant space between it and the thigh. Most likely it will be hanging ahead of the hip bone.

Without changing anything else, roll up onto the back toe with the knee relaxed and bent. You should find that the elbow has rested just behind the hip bone and the forearm is now touching the thigh like this:

14537

Work for allowing the back knee to "see" the the target. Maybe try an effort to drag the toenails.

It seems counterintuitive, but in your daughter's case, more brush is better. With her posture and leg orientation seen above, the boney part of the elbow was contacting the hip bone. With improved posture and getting the knee under the hip bone, it will allow you tuck the elbow in BEHIND the hip bone and the forearm can brush under it and across/around the soft area just below. There should be INSTANT relief!
 
Last edited:
Jun 7, 2018
10
3
Northwest Florida
Checking in to see how things are going? Her posture and leg orientation were key factors in the bone on bone contact. Try this: stand in the release position, but with the drag leg straight and the heel touching the ground like this:

View attachment 14536

Let the arm hang by the side and you should find that the arm has significant space between it and the thigh. Most likely it will be hanging ahead of the hip bone.

Without changing anything else, roll up onto the back toe with the knee relaxed and bent. You should find that the elbow has rested just behind the hip bone and the forearm is now touching the thigh like this:

View attachment 14537

Work for allowing the back knee to "see" the the target. Maybe try an effort to drag the toenails.

It seems counterintuitive, but in your daughter's case, more brush is better. With her posture and leg orientation seen above, the boney part of the elbow was contacting the hip bone. With improved posture getting the knee under the hip bone, allows you to tuck the elbow in BEHIND the hip bone and the forearm can brush under it and across/around the soft area just below. There should be INSTANT relief!

This is 100% correct, the back-side of the mechanic is not working properly here. She's fighting her lower body to get the pitch off.

I see A LOT of younger pitchers struggle with this, including one I work with. The cue that worked for us was literally just "let the back leg turn over." And I demonstrated that during overhand catch by having her focus on her rear leg when throwing and asking what it was doing? The answer: It turns so that the knee cap faces the target. It's the same thing for underhand pitching mechanics.

To work on it we literally just played underhand catch. Not a full windup or windmill, just underhand catch. Didn't take very long to correct once she felt it.

In our case, once she got it down she started to over rotate her trunk and shoulders a little and we had to then focus on front side resistance, but it didn't take long to work out. And there was major improvement in accuracy and correct spin within a couple of sessions.
 

h8weakness

Bucket Dad
Jan 9, 2019
35
8
Mishawaka, IN
Checking in to see how things are going? Her posture and leg orientation were key factors in the bone on bone contact. Try this: stand in the release position, but with the drag leg straight and the heel touching the ground like this:

View attachment 14536

Let the arm hang by the side and you should find that the arm has significant space between it and the thigh. Most likely it will be hanging ahead of the hip bone.

Without changing anything else, roll up onto the back toe with the knee relaxed and bent. You should find that the elbow has rested just behind the hip bone and the forearm is now touching the thigh like this:

View attachment 14537

Work for allowing the back knee to "see" the the target. Maybe try an effort to drag the toenails.

It seems counterintuitive, but in your daughter's case, more brush is better. With her posture and leg orientation seen above, the boney part of the elbow was contacting the hip bone. With improved posture getting the knee under the hip bone, allows you to tuck the elbow in BEHIND the hip bone and the forearm can brush under it and across/around the soft area just below. There should be INSTANT relief!

Holy cow.... I just came across your "Favorite pitching sites" My day is ruined. LOL. I've go so much that I need to learn. Since I'm at work for the next 20 hours.. I'll just be reading threads all day. :)

As for my daughter... well, I'm not sure I'm on the right track. We've gone with less brush to correct the problem and now she's pitching 4-5 mph slower and her accuracy has disappeared. Sure she's not hitting but now she's getting HIT and the coach keeps asking me WTH?!?!

We've started seeing a new coach too who seems to be pretty good. I explained that I thought she needed less brush because of how hard she was hitting her hipbone but after reading I'm realizing that less brush isn't the answer, proper brush is. Finding the right coach isn't easy. So far, my favorite coach who actually teaches Brush IR is 3.5 hours away... but our new one who was recommended to me by that coach is 1.5 hours away. Long story short... I need to learn to teach this and fast!
If you have any instructional video's that you HIGHLY recommend me checking out today.. please share. I'm a much more visual learner.
 
Feb 3, 2010
5,752
113
Pac NW
Although "brush" can be a cue, I think posture is a better focus. Brush can't happen without posture.

Here's a couple videos that touch on this:




Here's my process:

The key is to maximize good reps and eliminate bad reps. You will almost always need to decrease effort, distance and the distraction of control to the point where she can consistently get good reps.

Start close with quarter or half whips. Unlock the lower half and allow it the add to your posture. If you leave your feet planted and stand sideways, it’s impossible to get your hip and thigh stacked directly under the throwing shoulder.

Keep both arms flowing—up together, down together. Allow the lower arm to swing up naturally into a lagged/palm up position. In some cases, this might be slightly forced at first, but the goal is to feel loose snap/whip.

As long as there is good/stacked posture and loose lag/elbow flexion, you might ask her to try tucking her elbow farther back behind her hip bone and feel for brush all the way down to the wrist, or even pinky. Baggy nylon pants or shorts offer feedback she can feel as the arm brushes. I sometimes take a ten inch strip of no-residue duct tape, fold it over into itself in the middle to create a two inch flap and have them adhere it to the thigh where the blade of the hand brushes--about the 45 degree mark. Tape should look like this: ___|___

The person in front of you needs to be a “fetcher” and not a “catcher!” Have extra balls on hand. Use a net/tarp if needed.

Increase distance and effort gradually. One large step back at a time. If you have more than two bad reps in a row--change something. You don’t always need to step closer. Try several reps without a ball, then go back to the ball and throw as long as good reps are maintained. It may also help to close the eyes or get feedback from someone. No more than two bad reps before changing something. Always use video to double check--sometimes it looks perfect to the eye at full speed, but slow motion review never lies.

Patience and persistence. Don't give in to the temptation of going to the rubber and blasting away at spots unless she's needed in games.


Hope that's helpful,
Ken
 
Last edited:
Feb 3, 2010
5,752
113
Pac NW
Some ideas that might be helpful:

I'm seeing an extra effort to get open. Some pitchers can get away with this, but most end up in a less-than-optimum position at plant/release:

14550

I prefer an effort to drive squarely towards the target with the hips, shoulders, knees, nose and toes. As the arms and legs extend, the torso/hips will naturally open to about 45-60 degrees. "Think" about landing the plant foot pointing straight at the target, knowing it will end up around 35-45.

More cues:
-Think about relaxing the drag leg and dragging the toenails or
-Allowing the shoelaces to face the ground or
-Allowing the stride knee to "see" the target

Boomer's DD demonstrating this:
1455114552
 

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