Advice needed - 12U roster changes and playing time

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Oct 24, 2021
6
3
Hoping some more experienced parents and coaches can advise re: my DD current situation. She's first year 12U. The organization has four 12U teams and the one she's on is the weakest of the four. This team was formed in November after a "tryout" process, and has been practicing together since then, preparing for our short season that only just started - we live in the northeast.To give you a sense of the level, they recently played a B level tourney and got absolutely crushed in every game. We're not talking elite/showcase here. I know she's not at that level - she's just trying to get better and wants to improve by practicing with coaches and playing more than rec ball allows. She doesn't pitch or catch. I recently asked the coach for feedback on how she is doing and got no actionable feedback, just "she's doing great and the experience of this season will be good for her" - ok, good, I thought.

This past weekend, with no communication to parents, a bunch of roster moves were made. Three kids got dropped from the roster into the "development" group that only does practice and scrimmage. Taking their place were one kid from another of the org's teams (coach's daughter), one kid who joined a couple of weeks ago, and two kids who are literally brand new to the org as of this week. My daughter was not one of the kids who got dropped but as a knock-on effect of the changes her playing time was severely restricted this weekend - four at bats over three games, six and a half defensive innings out of sixteen. Meanwhile the ringer and the new players played 100%. And they lost 2 of 3 games.

This is our first travel ball experience and I'm trying to ascertain if that's simply what I should expect. Seems extremely cut-throat for this level. I have no problem with rotation and I understand that playing time is not guaranteed. At the same time, I'm spending hundreds (thousands, probably) of dollars and giving up precious weekends. I'm not doing it so I can watch other people's kids play softball, especially kids that haven't put the time in practicing with my kid all winter. It's pretty alarming and disheartening that kids who've been with the team for seven months were dropped in a heartbeat because some new players showed up.

If this is how it is everywhere, not sure I want any part of it.
 
Jun 8, 2016
16,118
113
Seems like odd moves to make mid-season but unless you know the full story (eg maybe the parents of the kids who got "dropped" wanted them moved for whatever reason..unlikely but possible) I wouldn't jump to any conclusions about that (and the related roster additions ) The PT issue for your kid is more of a problem and probably something I would address with the coach if it continues.
 
Oct 24, 2021
6
3
Seems like odd moves to make mid-season but unless you know the full story (eg maybe the parents of the kids who got "dropped" wanted them moved for whatever reason..unlikely but possible) I wouldn't jump to any conclusions about that (and the related roster additions ) The PT issue for your kid is more of a problem and probably something I would address with the coach if it continues.

Thanks, fair point - I can say (directly from the parents) that 2 of the 3 were definitely against their wishes. The other was borderline - she is a pitcher and was told she wouldn’t get many chances in our team. Yet the ringer and one of the newbies came straight in and pitched.


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Mar 22, 2010
128
28
There is just no reason for this on a 12U B team. Certainly going into next year you should look for a new organization where your DD will play and grow unless of course you want or need to leave earlier. Not sure where you are in the NE but feel free to send me a message and maybe I can offer some alternatives.
 
May 27, 2022
412
63
Been there/done that. One one hand, you want the team to see some success and the better players should play. On the other hand, all players/families are paying the same amount to support the team's expenses and should have equal access to playing time. Need to understand what was promised and just how good each player is compared to the rest of team.

My best experience was that my daughters played for an organization that everyone played and sat the same; 12 girls for the weekend would be 3 girls sitting for 35 minutes and then rotated in while the next 3 sat and then the next game 3 more would sit for half and then the last 3 for the last half of the second game.

My worst experience was a 6th grade VB where the the 4 favorites never came out and the other 6 rotated through the other the last 2 positions. For a local small time team, not a good experience.

I've heard others say that some cutthroat softball teams will get your money and then not play the bad kids while bringing in new kids until the bad kids just leave the team (while keeping the money).

Some programs even rotate the batting order so that the girl who got the last out one game would be the last batter the next game.

Or local BB program will try to play everyone equal unless their at the end of a close/competitive game.

I loved the experience of my daughters where everyone sat equal, but that was a good team with mostly equal talent that had been together for many years. But, you can't get clobbered every weekend and expect to continue on as a valid organization. At the end of the story, I think the best balance might be that everyone plays equally during pool play and then use that performance to define lineups for bracket play.

So, (as long as there aren't huge disparities in talent) if parents are all paying equally, they should expect to see their kids on the field every weekend. IMO, you can't take hundreds of dollars from some players just to subsidize the tournament fees of other players.
 
Jun 8, 2016
16,118
113
Thanks, fair point - I can say (directly from the parents) that 2 of the 3 were definitely against their wishes. The other was borderline - she is a pitcher and was told she wouldn’t get many chances in our team. Yet the ringer and one of the newbies came straight in and pitched.


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What were they given as a reason? Like I said it is odd to do at this point but if the spread in talent is pretty large (eg some kids are high B players while others are Rec) then I can see how redistributing talent might serve everyone well, even at this point in the season.
 
Oct 3, 2011
3,478
113
Right Here For Now
12U is all about player development. A good coach will make sure that all of their players are developing better fielding, throwing, hitting, pitching, catching and baserunning skills. They will also make sure that their players will get maximum playing time to advance their game situational awareness and other game skills. From your description of the team, I'm guessing they are a C level team. This is especially true for that level of play.

It sounds to me as if they don't know how to truly develop their players. The coach has deemed to forego that. They essentially cut players in order to replace them with better players in order to win a few games. If they're doing this at the lowest level of play in the TB world, what do you think will happen as the team moves up in skill levels? Usually coaches that do this see success to the detriment of the players. They care more about winning than making sure their players are actually growing. Instead, they are constantly looking for the next best player to replace one on their current roster.

You mentioned it was a short season. For your sake, I hope it's measured in days because at the end, you should find another team.
 
Last edited:
Feb 14, 2019
145
43
Hoping some more experienced parents and coaches can advise re: my DD current situation. She's first year 12U. The organization has four 12U teams and the one she's on is the weakest of the four. This team was formed in November after a "tryout" process, and has been practicing together since then, preparing for our short season that only just started - we live in the northeast.To give you a sense of the level, they recently played a B level tourney and got absolutely crushed in every game. We're not talking elite/showcase here. I know she's not at that level - she's just trying to get better and wants to improve by practicing with coaches and playing more than rec ball allows. She doesn't pitch or catch. I recently asked the coach for feedback on how she is doing and got no actionable feedback, just "she's doing great and the experience of this season will be good for her" - ok, good, I thought.

This past weekend, with no communication to parents, a bunch of roster moves were made. Three kids got dropped from the roster into the "development" group that only does practice and scrimmage. Taking their place were one kid from another of the org's teams (coach's daughter), one kid who joined a couple of weeks ago, and two kids who are literally brand new to the org as of this week. My daughter was not one of the kids who got dropped but as a knock-on effect of the changes her playing time was severely restricted this weekend - four at bats over three games, six and a half defensive innings out of sixteen. Meanwhile the ringer and the new players played 100%. And they lost 2 of 3 games.

This is our first travel ball experience and I'm trying to ascertain if that's simply what I should expect. Seems extremely cut-throat for this level. I have no problem with rotation and I understand that playing time is not guaranteed. At the same time, I'm spending hundreds (thousands, probably) of dollars and giving up precious weekends. I'm not doing it so I can watch other people's kids play softball, especially kids that haven't put the time in practicing with my kid all winter. It's pretty alarming and disheartening that kids who've been with the team for seven months were dropped in a heartbeat because some new players showed up.

If this is how it is everywhere, not sure I want any part of it.
While I definitely agree that younger ages are about player development, it's really hard to foster a love of the game if the team is getting crushed every time they step on the field. Winning should not be the main goal, but being able to go out and compete is very important. Were the kids who got dropped that far behind the others in their skill level? I'm also curious why the org has four 12B teams with a "developmental" group that only practices...It seems like having a 12C team or two might be a good option to function as a "developmental" group. I know sometimes coaches/parents egos don't allow them to do that...

And I also do not believe that everything has to be equal when it comes to playing time, but it should be reasonable. Playing less than half the innings in a weekend seems pretty low. If the coaches can't figure out how to give each player ample time on the field, they're either too lazy to work out a decent rotation or they're just plain doing something wrong.

The part I really have a hard time with is the lack of communication about the roster changes. That's a huge red flag for me and I would probably begin carefully and discreetly checking out other organizations in your area.
 

radness

Possibilities & Opportunities!
Dec 13, 2019
7,270
113
It is appropriate at the beginning of a season for a coach to address everybody what their plans to reach an end goal result are, however there are always going to be changes to things that have been happening... plus players/people have to do there part of the plan, and even the best plans may need adjustment as some parts of the plan fail... so plans may change. Think it's unreasonable to think a coach should have to explain everything they do or why.

Even knowing the reasons there could be more debate or frustration even if you knew why.

Focus on what you can control. Keep your daughter positive and purposeful if you want ask coach of her role on the team. Ok!

Not the time in a season to switch teams.
 

radness

Possibilities & Opportunities!
Dec 13, 2019
7,270
113
Hoping some more experienced parents and coaches can advise re: my DD current situation. She's first year 12U. The organization has four 12U teams and the one she's on is the weakest of the four. This team was formed in November after a "tryout" process, and has been practicing together since then, preparing for our short season that only just started - we live in the northeast.To give you a sense of the level, they recently played a B level tourney and got absolutely crushed in every game. We're not talking elite/showcase here. I know she's not at that level - she's just trying to get better and wants to improve by practicing with coaches and playing more than rec ball allows. She doesn't pitch or catch. I recently asked the coach for feedback on how she is doing and got no actionable feedback, just "she's doing great and the experience of this season will be good for her" - ok, good, I thought.

This past weekend, with no communication to parents, a bunch of roster moves were made. Three kids got dropped from the roster into the "development" group that only does practice and scrimmage. Taking their place were one kid from another of the org's teams (coach's daughter), one kid who joined a couple of weeks ago, and two kids who are literally brand new to the org as of this week. My daughter was not one of the kids who got dropped but as a knock-on effect of the changes her playing time was severely restricted this weekend - four at bats over three games, six and a half defensive innings out of sixteen. Meanwhile the ringer and the new players played 100%. And they lost 2 of 3 games.

This is our first travel ball experience and I'm trying to ascertain if that's simply what I should expect. Seems extremely cut-throat for this level. I have no problem with rotation and I understand that playing time is not guaranteed. At the same time, I'm spending hundreds (thousands, probably) of dollars and giving up precious weekends. I'm not doing it so I can watch other people's kids play softball, especially kids that haven't put the time in practicing with my kid all winter. It's pretty alarming and disheartening that kids who've been with the team for seven months were dropped in a heartbeat because some new players showed up.

If this is how it is everywhere, not sure I want any part of it.
Here are important questions,
How many innings/% do you think all the players should get on the team? And should everybody get an equal amount of innings?

Simply asking because teams have different goals and some of them are starting 9 will play in tournaments.
While others are used as fill in when possible.
 

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