I've never seen this, is it normal? Umpire issue

Frost033 said:

So this weekend my team was playing in a tournament and I encountered a few things I've never had happen in 10+ years of coaching.

First. Early in the game there was a play at first in which my team hit the ball down 3rd base line and the girl made a great play and threw across the diamond. The throw was slightly short so the girl had to stretch for it and pulled her foot off the base. The outfield up, who was behind the shortstop called her out. I asked him for an appeal to the home plate ump, who had a better view, and he told me "No, you're not getting an appeal" I looked to the home ump, he said "Unless he asks for help, I can't do anything."

Second. Their player was running to 1st and ran through the base. She made a turn towards 2nd, stepped into the field of play and walked back towards 1st. My player tagged her because she made that step. I'm not sure if she thought about 2nd or not, but she clearly stepped into the field of play. Again, the ump is behind the shortstop, calls her safe and I asked for an appeal. Like the last time, he told me "No." I walked out and asked him if we could please get a second opinion from the home ump because he can see down the line. He told me "Not a chance" and walked away from me.

Third (and final). Their girl bunted down 1st baseline. As she broke down the line, she kicked the ball. She was clearly out of the box. The home ump called her out. The field ump jumped in and said "No, she was in the box, thats a foul ball, she goes back." I asked the plate ump "Isn't that your call, not his?" And he just shrugged.

After the game I tried to talk to both umps and was met with a ton of disrespect. I said "Twice, I asked for an appeal and twice you denied it, why would you do that?" He said "Because I didn't need help, I know I'm right" I was angry and made it clear, he then told me that I was "A terrible coach and needed to go home".


Basically, I'm just wondering if I'm totally wrong here and the field umps don't allow for appeals and regularly deny them. I've never encountered it, but I've only been doing travel ball a short time. I've never seen it in HS ball.

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MTR said:

^^^ THIS

But let me add, what the base umpire did was unethical and in violation of (in USA) 10.3.B. That is an issue for the UIC and is not a point of appeal or protest

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Chris8 said:

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MTR can you elaborate which part was unethical and in violation?

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marriard said:

Despite all of the above, my goal is to limit and eliminate 'gross mistakes' and I will absolutely go to my partner for help when appropriate. I will do it without the coach even coming out when appropriate.

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Coach JV said:

My $.02, unfortunately, questionable umpiring is part of the game.
No appeal on judgement calls, also, (I don't know the history), umpires have
good memories when it involves past encounters.

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I am of the school, where I only ask for appeal where it is a critical part of the game and the score is close.
Like someone else mentioned, it drives umpires crazy when coaches are calling
Time Out too frequently...... this being said, NEVER QUESTION JUDGEMENT CALLS,
umpires will assume that coach does not know the rules when judgement is called
into question by a coach. Again, this is my opinion-best of luck!

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MTR said:

Remember, yes. You know like when the coach tells you, "That hasn't been call illegal all year", only for me to remind him I had his game the previous week and called the same thing twice including an explanation why it was called. However, what is in the past stays there and should be irrelevant to any future action



Well, a coach cannot call time, so if the umpire continues to call time, that is on him/her.

If a coach has a valid question, it should be raised immediately. A good umpire should never have a problem with that. And it usually isn't judgment which is the question, but what the umpire saw or didn't see and that shouldn't be a problem either. Now, after getting your explanation and they want to debate the judgment, they you will have a problem.

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Chris8 said:

Agree but you can respectfully ask what the umpire saw. We had a game where our runner stole third...was safe....but the view the PU (who was the only ump) had was blocked and he called her out. End of inning as I head to the dugout conversation goes like this...

PU says "Coach, I know you thought she was safe..."
Me "she was.."
PU " tough when there's only me doing the game and my view was blocked by the 3B and it look like she got the tag down before the runner was on the bag"
ME "I get it. Not easy at times."
PU "appreciate you not questioning the judgement call"
ME " I saw it different...but then I'm her coach No worries"
PU "You probably had a better view, I'll try to do better....(said with a smile)"

Later that game same situation...even a closer play and he calls our girl safe....OTHER COACH loses it calls time and becomes "that coach". Girl eventually scores.

And then we had a girl on third that they tried to pick off....very close play...called safe diving back to the bag (could have gone either way with only one umpire). OTHER COACH loses it again... Girl eventually scores.

My girls commented after the game about the OTHER COACH losing it on the umpire and that they think he didn't get calls his way because he was so vocal.

Teachable moments if you use them.

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