Infield Pop-Up Scoring Question

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Jul 16, 2013
4,659
113
Pennsylvania
Hustle and hierarchy are important in assigning responsibility, but not errors, IMO.

I certainly respect your opinion, but I typically follow the rule listed below when scoring. If "ordinary effort... retired a runner", I score it an error. Similar play occurred in a dome tournament this winter. DD was up to bat against a gold team with 8 college commits. She hits a pop up towards second base. 2b calls the ball immediately and glides under it. Then SS also calls ball. Both back away and the ball bounces on the turf. DD is standing on first base, but I scored it an error. No way that ball should have fallen and no way DD should get credit for a hit. Just my opinion...

The comment after Rule 10.12(a)(1) says “…It is not necessary that the fielder touch the ball to be charged with an error. … For example, the official scorer shall charge an infielder with an error when a ground ball passes to either side of such infielder if, in the official scorer’s judgement, a fielder at that position making ordinary effort would have fielded such ground ball and retired a runner.”
 
May 4, 2016
70
18
East Coast
While we are talking scoring and errors, how about a hard line drive to f5 who's playing, ball hits her glove but bounces up and over. Error or hit?

So much momentum behind a truly hard hit 12" softball that I personally record these as hits rather than errors. However, I'm currently scoring 12U. Maybe once you get to a higher level this becomes an error... (Yes, errors should not technically be subjective, but "routine" isn't the same for 10C vs. 16A.)
 
Jun 27, 2011
5,089
0
North Carolina
I certainly respect your opinion, but I typically follow the rule listed below when scoring. If "ordinary effort... retired a runner", I score it an error. Similar play occurred in a dome tournament this winter. DD was up to bat against a gold team with 8 college commits. She hits a pop up towards second base. 2b calls the ball immediately and glides under it. Then SS also calls ball. Both back away and the ball bounces on the turf. DD is standing on first base, but I scored it an error. No way that ball should have fallen and no way DD should get credit for a hit. Just my opinion...

The comment after Rule 10.12(a)(1) says “…It is not necessary that the fielder touch the ball to be charged with an error. … For example, the official scorer shall charge an infielder with an error when a ground ball passes to either side of such infielder if, in the official scorer’s judgement, a fielder at that position making ordinary effort would have fielded such ground ball and retired a runner.”

This is the NCAA rule that I'd follow here:

No error is charged to a fielder in the following situations:

14.22.2 When there is a mental mistake.


The rule you site points out that a fielder doesn't have to touch the ball to be charged with an error. No argument there. But the example given is a ball in which the fielder failed to catch for no other reason than her failure to put the glove where it needed to be. She was in position to catch it w/ ordinary effort, but didn't.

In the case of the popup, the fielders were not in position to catch it when it needed to be caught (because of their indecision, ie, mental error).

For me, ordinary effort isn't so much about the effort required to get to the ball, but rather the ordinary effort required to catch the ball once it needs to be caught. Whether a fielder should have gotten to a ball (tracked it better, hustled more, called off the SS, etc.) is a lot more subjective and not generally a part of a scorekeeper's judgment to decide, IMO.
 

Greenmonsters

Wannabe Duck Boat Owner
Feb 21, 2009
6,168
38
New England
I certainly respect your opinion, but I typically follow the rule listed below when scoring. If "ordinary effort... retired a runner", I score it an error. Similar play occurred in a dome tournament this winter. DD was up to bat against a gold team with 8 college commits. She hits a pop up towards second base. 2b calls the ball immediately and glides under it. Then SS also calls ball. Both back away and the ball bounces on the turf. DD is standing on first base, but I scored it an error. No way that ball should have fallen and no way DD should get credit for a hit. Just my opinion...

The comment after Rule 10.12(a)(1) says “…It is not necessary that the fielder touch the ball to be charged with an error. … For example, the official scorer shall charge an infielder with an error when a ground ball passes to either side of such infielder if, in the official scorer’s judgement, a fielder at that position making ordinary effort would have fielded such ground ball and retired a runner.”

Base hit. An official scorer does have to use judgement at times, but the can't selectively decide which scoring rules to apply. A pop up or fly that falls untouched between fielders specifically is Ruled a hit under NCAA scoring guidelines.
 
Jul 16, 2013
4,659
113
Pennsylvania
Base hit. An official scorer does have to use judgement at times, but the can't selectively decide which scoring rules to apply. A pop up or fly that falls untouched between fielders specifically is Ruled a hit under NCAA scoring guidelines.

Understood. I guess it is the baseball guy coming out in me...

I stand corrected. In my example with DD, I scored her at bat as an error on the SS, when I should have actually given her a hit. She won't let me hear the end of that one, lol! That means she was actually 4-4 that game instead of the 3-4 I gave her credit for. I guess it's a good thing I don't do the scoring very often. That said, I still think "lack of hustle" could potentially result in an error depending on the circumstances when utilizing the "ordinary effort" rule. In my earlier example, the CF could have easily made the catch just by taking one or two more steps, and she had plenty of time to do that.


Non Errors[edit]
Not all misplays result in an error. Errors in judgment are not usually counted as errors. For example, if, because of confusion or miscommunication, a fly ball that is easily catchable falls between two fielders without either of them touching the ball, no error is charged, as it is impossible to determine who is the guilty party. Similarly, if a fielder chooses to attempt a difficult play at a base to try to retire a runner and fails, instead of making an easy out on the batter, the play will be scored a fielder's choice and not an error.
 
Last edited:
Jun 6, 2016
2,714
113
Chicago
Understood. I guess it is the baseball guy coming out in me...

I'd wager that never in the history of MLB has an error been assigned to a fielder on the play described in the OP. If all the fielders just stare at each other and the ball drops, it's a hit.

And this is why errors (and earned/unearned runs) are kind of dumb.
 
May 30, 2011
143
0
I spent some time today with my nose in a rule book looking for some guidance and found what I believe supports the local coach's position:

A base hit is credited to a batter when she advances to a base safely:
14.3.14 If the ball is not touched because of confusion as to who should have fielded it

What rule set?
 
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