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Thread: Drive leg

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    Certified softball maniac NVfishing's Avatar
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    Default Drive leg

    Right now DD has plateaued in speed. Watching video all her speed comes from the upper body. She's leaving her drive leg behind. Are there any drills that can get the drive leg to finish strong and in sync with the arm whip? I always hear knee to knee finish. The ball is long gone with her drive leg well behind her at release. Yuki Ueno has the drive leg and her release in sync.


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    Quote Originally Posted by NVfishing View Post
    Right now DD has plateaued in speed. Watching video all her speed comes from the upper body. She's leaving her drive leg behind. Are there any drills that can get the drive leg to finish strong and in sync with the arm whip? I always hear knee to knee finish. The ball is long gone with her drive leg well behind her at release. Yuki Ueno has the drive leg and her release in sync.
    Why do you think leg drive will help her speed? What is it about the leg drive and what happens during the leg drive that you perceive will increase her velocity?

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    I'm a fan matt's Avatar
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    A video can be very helpful in this case. In order to see where the drive sequence is off. It may be happening a lot earlier than you realize.

    Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

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    My guess from what your describing is she is drive leg dominant, but of course a vid would help. Is she coming off the plate by 3:00? What type of shape does the push leg make? Is it a "?" or more of a "\".

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    Quote Originally Posted by NVfishing View Post
    Right now DD has plateaued in speed. Watching video all her speed comes from the upper body. She's leaving her drive leg behind. Are there any drills that can get the drive leg to finish strong and in sync with the arm whip? I always hear knee to knee finish. The ball is long gone with her drive leg well behind her at release. Yuki Ueno has the drive leg and her release in sync.
    I'll translate what you've provided into a couple possibilities. 1) She's got a heavy trail foot, maybe ruddering and is draining energy behind in the backside. 2) She's a Figure-4 finisher (knee-to-knee) and is also wasting energy by artificially altering any type of rotational follow-through. Either way, she may be missing throwing side torso, hip, knee and foot rotation back around 45 and into her follow-through.

    Both are common flaws, both result in less-than-efficient kinetic energy release. In fact, it's only natural to attempt to make up for inefficiencies in the footwork with the upper body. Usually it's only just a bandage, and not a cure. She probably throws very well, but has the potential to be better.

    Yes, there are drills. Essentially, you want a strong push into a resistant plant at 45. Approximately after release, that trail side torso, hip, knee and foot is well off the gas, light and is rotational as most of the kinetic energy is already released. If her trail side leg never achieves release and rotation back open, what you're descibing with the lower/upper halves out-of-sync would be true.

    Chris
    Last edited by Chris Delorit; 12-17-2018 at 04:51 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Delorit View Post
    I'll translate what you've provided into a couple possibilities. 1) She's got a heavy trail foot, maybe ruddering and is draining energy behind in the backside. 2) She's a Figure-4 finisher (knee-to-knee) and is also wasting energy by artificially altering any type of rotational follow-through. Either way, she may be missing throwing side torso, hip, knee and foot rotation back around 45 and into her follow-through.

    Both are common flaws, both result in less-than-efficient kinetic energy release. In fact, it's only natural to attempt to make up for inefficiencies in the footwork with the upper body. Usually it's only just a bandage, and not a cure. She probably throws very well, but has the potential to be better.

    Yes, there are drills. Essentially, you want a strong push into a resistant plant at 45. Approximately after release, that trail side torso, hip, knee and foot is well off the gas, light and is rotational as most of the kinetic energy is already released. If her trail side leg never achieves release and rotation back open, what you're descibing with the lower/upper halves out-of-sync would be true.

    Chris
    She rudders. Drive leg foot down sideways, think bowling leg. She's 14, when younger 8 thru beginning 12 she had a bad leap. I believe there could be more synchronicity of the drive leg toward the batter with the ball release/hip angle at 45 deg. Right now the ball comes thru and is released in front of the hip with a weak/forced follow thru with the hip/knee.

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    Right, in ruddering with the trail foot, the entire throwing side is stuck behind in hostage because of that awkward east/west movement. A couple of things can be occuring. 1) She's already rotating the drive foot excessively while pushing off of the rubber. 2) She's landing at a plant well in excess of 45 degrees. Either way, the trail side is essentially left behind stuck in mud and is never allowed to rotate back around her plant.

    One example of a pretty simple drill would be slow and methodical up/downs from a 45-degree slingshot delivery, where she's working on feeling more linear transfer rhythym and synergy within the drive, plant and trail movements. So, you're looking to map the footwork to define, simplify and create more efficiency. Get better there, and synergy between the quadrants should improve.

    Chris
    Last edited by Chris Delorit; 12-20-2018 at 05:28 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Delorit View Post
    Right, in ruddering with the trail foot, the entire throwing side is stuck behind in hostage because of that awkward east/west movement. A couple of things can be occuring. 1) She's already rotating the drive foot excessively while pushing off of the rubber. 2) She's landing at a plant well in excess of 45 degrees. Either way, the trail side is essentially left behind stuck in mud and is never allowed to rotate back around her plant.

    One example of a pretty simple drill would be slow and methodical up/downs from a 45-degree slingshot delivery, where she's working on feeling more linear transfer rhythym and synergy within the drive, plant and trail movements. So, you're looking to map the footwork to define, simplify and create more efficiency. Get better there, and synergy between the quadrants should improve.

    Chris
    Thank you, Chris. After reading this and going back over vids of both my DD and a transitioning HE student, I can see they are both wide open (hips) at plant. The drive foot really has no choice but to rudder. Am I following you correctly? It maybe that when folks look at pics of pitchers, the angle makes it look like they're wide open and so people assume that's what it should be. We're throwing tonight so we'll work on plant. Once again the to-fix list gets re-ordered.
    the map isn't the territory

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    Ok, so not as worried about her speed tonight as I was on Sunday. Pitched tonight with three different speed measurements. Low 52 high of 59. Steady 54-55. On sunday we were indoors inside netting. Her coach told me she thought the nets interfere with the radar. I tend to agree after the readings tonight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cvsoftball View Post
    Thank you, Chris. After reading this and going back over vids of both my DD and a transitioning HE student, I can see they are both wide open (hips) at plant. The drive foot really has no choice but to rudder. Am I following you correctly? It maybe that when folks look at pics of pitchers, the angle makes it look like they're wide open and so people assume that's what it should be. We're throwing tonight so we'll work on plant. Once again the to-fix list gets re-ordered.
    Hi cv,

    Sure, your spot on. The furthur past 45 the plant is, the more the knees, hips, torso and shoulders have to adjust to the plant foot in the very same direction. The mechanics become both less efficient and less productive and usually introduce posture issues which can have a negative effect on speed, accuracy, movement. The greater the plant beyond 45, the higher the chance of counterproductive inefficiencies. You mentioned ruddering, and there's also the gluteous kickout, introduction of pushing the ball rather than pulling and whipping the ball down through release just to mention a couple.

    So in pitching, it's natural to start open, plant to a degree closed and then finish open again. The furthur the plant deviates past 45 toward 90 degrees, the greater the fight to find balance (and sometimes struggle or won't) and get back to open again.

    Remember, order comes from geometry...curves, angles and patterns.

    Last edited by Chris Delorit; 12-21-2018 at 03:44 AM.

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