- May 17, 2012
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Many of you are focused on the individual outcome but as RichK pointed out above there was also larger goal to taking pitches in baseball.
"Take more pitches"??
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DD's coach is on a crusade, no called 3rd strikes.
We strike out and swing at some bad pitches but you better not have a called 3rd strike.
Agree with them by the way.
We strike out and swing at some bad pitches but you better not have a called 3rd strike.
Agree with them by the way.
- Feb 7, 2013
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A few random thoughts:
- one of the goals of the pitcher is to get ahead of the batter as quickly as possible (e.g. throwing a first pitch strike).
- the first pitch of the at-bat may be the best pitch the batter sees during the at-bat.
- a batter should be looking for a pitch within their own "personal" hitting zone. If the pitch is in that zone, they should be attacking that pitch.
- some coaches say never swing at a change-up unless you have 2 strikes on you. Stupid advice, if you recognize the pitch as a change-up and can hit it hard, go for it. Otherwise, as a pitcher I'm throwing you two change-ups in a row if you ain't swinging, and you will quickly get behind in the count (0-2)
- DD had a coach that told all his players to NOT swing at the first pitch. Again, bad advice if its a pitch that you can hit hard and is in your zone.
In summary, there may be certain situations where you want to take a lot of pitches (e.g. pitcher struggling; baserunner attempting steal; batter has been struggling at the plate; slowing the game down in timed games, etc.) but there should be no general rule to "take lots of pitches" IMO.
- one of the goals of the pitcher is to get ahead of the batter as quickly as possible (e.g. throwing a first pitch strike).
- the first pitch of the at-bat may be the best pitch the batter sees during the at-bat.
- a batter should be looking for a pitch within their own "personal" hitting zone. If the pitch is in that zone, they should be attacking that pitch.
- some coaches say never swing at a change-up unless you have 2 strikes on you. Stupid advice, if you recognize the pitch as a change-up and can hit it hard, go for it. Otherwise, as a pitcher I'm throwing you two change-ups in a row if you ain't swinging, and you will quickly get behind in the count (0-2)
- DD had a coach that told all his players to NOT swing at the first pitch. Again, bad advice if its a pitch that you can hit hard and is in your zone.
In summary, there may be certain situations where you want to take a lot of pitches (e.g. pitcher struggling; baserunner attempting steal; batter has been struggling at the plate; slowing the game down in timed games, etc.) but there should be no general rule to "take lots of pitches" IMO.
It really depends.
If the pitcher is struggling, it's the undisciplined hitter that swings at whatever with one or no strikes.
However, as my DD gets older and encounters increasingly effective pitching, I constantly remind her that the first pitch might be the best one she sees.
If the pitcher is struggling, it's the undisciplined hitter that swings at whatever with one or no strikes.
However, as my DD gets older and encounters increasingly effective pitching, I constantly remind her that the first pitch might be the best one she sees.
- Feb 3, 2011
- 1,880
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Pitch counts mean so much more in baseball than in softball, but hitters need to learn to recognize their best pitches regardless of count. My working thought is that a batter should be looking for her pitch with less than 2 strikes. Ultimately, the job of the batter is to make the job of the pitcher as difficult as possible. A lot of coaches hate the check swing, but if a batter is unsure about the umpire's zone, then it's definitely better to live to face another pitch than to be sat down thinking you just drew ball 4.
On really hot days, making the defense spend lots of time in the sun is viable game strategy. When you're only batting .180 with 1st pitches put into play, it may be time to thinking about extending an at-bat or 2.
On really hot days, making the defense spend lots of time in the sun is viable game strategy. When you're only batting .180 with 1st pitches put into play, it may be time to thinking about extending an at-bat or 2.
- a batter should be looking for a pitch within their own "personal" hitting zone. If the pitch is in that zone, they should be attacking that pitch.
This is key. Don't go up on a 0-0 count trying to hit anything in the strike zone. Hit something that you want to hit and are looking for. If you don't get it, live to see another pitch.
This is one of those things that's frequently stated as a fact, but I've never seen any evidence to suggest it's true, especially at higher levels where pitchers can grab a first-pitch strike with an off-speed/breaking pitch or a well-placed pitch on the corner.
In MLB, we now have the technology and data to determine whether it's true, but not sure anybody's ever actually studied it.
Since Moneyball was brought up, this reminds me a lot of Scott Hatteberg's time with the Red Sox. He had great numbers when he swung at the first pitch, so the Red Sox tried to get him to swing at more first pitches. His performance tanked. It turned out that his numbers were so good in that situation because he would only swing if it was a pitch he could crush. When he started trying to swing at more first pitches, he would swing at worse ones (still strikes, perhaps, but not "his pitch").
So instead of encouraging hitters to swing early in the count, I'd teach them to identify "their pitch" and swing if they get that pitch. Later in the count you can't be so picky, but early on, there's no good reason to swing at a pitch that isn't exactly what you're looking for.
Agreed. DD's hitting is peaking as we start our provincial (state) championships here. Early in the season she led the team in OBP b/c she was getting lots of walks (she is an '04 on an 03/04 team but is the biggest and arguably strongest kid on the team) and the coach told me "Every team of kids this age I've coached, the leader in walks has been one of the weakest hitters." It kinda rubbed me the wrong way at the time, but also rang true to a certain extent. Years ago when we were in rec ball and the pitchers couldn't throw strikes, like many girls DD learned to work the count, try to get a walk, and swing the bat only if she had to.
As we've progressed through the season the pitchers have gotten better and there are really few walks anymore. So I recently told DD to be more aggressive - why stand in the box and watch what could be the best pitch of the AB go by you for strike 1? Pay attention when you are on deck and be ready to crush the first pitch.
We played two days ago and she saw six pitches in four plate appearances. She was 3-4 with 3 RBI and her lone out was a long fly ball to left after fouling off the first pitch of the AB. We've also been spending lots of time doing BP at the local diamond (me pitching buckets of balls with two little brothers shagging flies) and the results have been really good. My honest belief is that she sees the ball better than anyone else on her team - almost never swings at a bad pitch - so coupling that with an aggressive approach should be effective for her.
- May 17, 2012
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- 113
I thought I was the only one thinking this. Maybe this depends on the level of play but I haven't seen a "fat" first pitch once this season. It would be deposited in the parking lot somewhere.
Most likely the first pitch is the pitchers most effective pitch that can be thrown for a strike (if she is throwing a strike). Good luck with that.
Watch the pitcher. First strike tendency is just another pattern to figure out with each individual pitcher you face, the same as understanding their out-pitch or changeup tendencies....
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