Dusty, I once thought that way until a HS coach explained to me her rationale for it. She said the pitcher in question had a very good drop ball for an out pitch, or weak ground ball out but if it wasn't working she would struggle with pitch count for the game anyway, so if she could find her grove between an inning she would keep her in and it would reduce her overall pitch count in the game, if she couldn't find her grove in between the inning she would go with another pitcher. I watched her do this several times during the season and it seemed like a decent strategy. The pitchers where only pitching 2 maybe 3 games in a week in HS so very little chance of over use compared to what these girls see in TB. If you only have one pitcher then this is probably not a good idea.
HS pitching and parenting
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At advanced levels, a pitcher will likely not go more than 4 innings without a breaking pitch. So, you're right, "no breaking pitch" would substantially reduce the pitch count.
An advanced pitcher can fix a breaking pitch in maybe 5 to 10 pitches. The problem is almost certainly body position. The pitcher slows the motion down and focuses on body and hand position...probably throwing at 50 MPH rather than 60+ MPH. Maybe my DD was different...she could throw 50MPH pitches forever without breaking a sweat.
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So HS ball is considered an "advanced level", lol. Would not disagree with pitching between innings in the circumstance Woody mentioned above but otherwise would not recommend practicing pitches in the bullpen during games. Fixing pitches is best done during practice time and ideally in the company of a good (non-HS) pitching coach. To each their own though.
You've never seen an advanced pitcher in HS? Perhaps you should get out more.
An advanced pitcher knows how to throw the breaking pitch. She understands the mechanics of throwing a breaking pitch, and understands the reasons why a breaking pitch might not work.
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All this talk about parents in the stands makes me think about my own high school baseball days (and little league and legion ball for that matter). My dad would rarely make my games because of his job, but he would try to make some when he could. My mom would also rarely make my games but would make a few. Typically after the game was over, the first thing they would ask is "did you hear me cheering for you". I always told them yes, but to be honest, the answer was a resounding "no". For whatever reason, as soon as I entered the dugout and then the field, I tended to tune everything else out. I would hear my teammates. I would hear my coaches. I would hear the umpires. But everything coming from the stands (positive or negative) was nothing more than background noise. I have talked to my daughter about this and she claims to experience the same thing. So even if I was sitting outside the fence barking things at her, I seriously doubt she would hear a single word I said. Based on many of these posts, it seems DD and I would be in the minority here.
Weak CYA attempt, I think even hal skinner would have come up with something better than this. You posted "At advanced levels (presumably HS per your thread title), a pitcher will likely not go more than 4 innings without a breaking pitch" suggesting that your dd will get lit up and not make it through the 4th inning against HS hitters unless she hits the bullpen between innings and gets her movement pitches working just right. I haven't had that experience when my dd is pitching HS but maybe that's because I haven't watched enough of other HS teams playing.
Dusty...my bad. I remember now...you're the guy we've banned a dozen times for trolling. I thought you actually wanted to discuss something. Sorry. Carry on.
Wrong again sluggers. I’ve never been banned for any reason from this site or any other web forum I frequent. You’ve got the keys to the shop so I guess you could ban me but I’m sure anyone reading this thread objectively will see it as a reflection on you rather than me.
My posting history here in short is as follows; joined when my dd’s where 10-12u pitchers and found it to be a great resource even though I was never a highly active poster. I stopped posting or lurking for a few years when my oldest dd decided not to pursue softball in college and my youngest dd was leaning that way.
I only came back recently because my youngest dd had enough pitching success to revisit college softball options and start the recruiting process. I did start a thread on one of the college ball forums about the academic side of college softball and you did your best to derail it by posting a bunch of clichés about the playing side. Fortunately, a few posters actually read my posts before posting and did contribute some useful information including a few PM's that I only recently noticed.
Getting back to this thread, your OP was one of the most patronizing things I’ve read on the web. I’ve never witnessed the behavior you describe at a HS game and I think most posters here would be unlikely to go into a dugout to coach up their dd pitchers during a game. I’ve known a few parents (mostly travel) who exile themselves to the outfield during a game but most pitcher parents I know are perfectly capable of self-restraint and can sit wherever they want.
So other than being a moderator here, which doesn’t mean much in the real world, what are your qualifications to be the dispenser of wisdom here? Are you currently a high level pitching instructor with tons of successful students at the D1 P5 level?
As I recall (and please correct me if I’m wrong), your dd pitched a very long time ago at the D2 or D3 level with antiquated pitching mechanics and has permanent injuries to show for it. There most likely was not the kind of resources like this site available in her day to correct flawed mechanics and earning a college degree through college athletics is something any parent would be proud of but it does not make you the authority on advanced level pitching today or parental conduct.
My posting history here in short is as follows; joined when my dd’s where 10-12u pitchers and found it to be a great resource even though I was never a highly active poster. I stopped posting or lurking for a few years when my oldest dd decided not to pursue softball in college and my youngest dd was leaning that way.
I only came back recently because my youngest dd had enough pitching success to revisit college softball options and start the recruiting process. I did start a thread on one of the college ball forums about the academic side of college softball and you did your best to derail it by posting a bunch of clichés about the playing side. Fortunately, a few posters actually read my posts before posting and did contribute some useful information including a few PM's that I only recently noticed.
Getting back to this thread, your OP was one of the most patronizing things I’ve read on the web. I’ve never witnessed the behavior you describe at a HS game and I think most posters here would be unlikely to go into a dugout to coach up their dd pitchers during a game. I’ve known a few parents (mostly travel) who exile themselves to the outfield during a game but most pitcher parents I know are perfectly capable of self-restraint and can sit wherever they want.
So other than being a moderator here, which doesn’t mean much in the real world, what are your qualifications to be the dispenser of wisdom here? Are you currently a high level pitching instructor with tons of successful students at the D1 P5 level?
As I recall (and please correct me if I’m wrong), your dd pitched a very long time ago at the D2 or D3 level with antiquated pitching mechanics and has permanent injuries to show for it. There most likely was not the kind of resources like this site available in her day to correct flawed mechanics and earning a college degree through college athletics is something any parent would be proud of but it does not make you the authority on advanced level pitching today or parental conduct.
The point of the thread was how pitcher parents should act at softball games. There has been a lot of good discussion back and forth.
Wow....you *do* need to get out more.
I saw the conduct I described last weekend, and I've seen the same conduct several times over the last 30 years or so.
I don't know what the posters here do. But, there was a good, lively discussion about it.
My DD#1 pitched D1 Juco ball, and went to the D1 Juco world series twice. Her former juco coach became a D1 coach. After juco, DD#1 became an NCAA D1 all-conference pitcher. Her max speed was 67MPH. She had a nasty drop ball, which was as good as any drop ball I've seen. (As I've said many times before, her biggest drawback was that she didn't have a good changeup.)
My DD#3 played hoops, scored something around 1400 points in HS, played D3 and won a national championship. So, I've been through the college sports mill three times.
My kids loved played college sports. It was amazing to watch them play.
As to softball pitching mechanics, there are people here more qualified than me. There are a lot of really good people here. I've learned a lot.
I have some expertise as to what it takes to help make a child into a successful college athlete. I've done it twice. I've also seen kids with more talent than my DD crash and burn.
Wow....you *do* need to get out more.
I saw the conduct I described last weekend, and I've seen the same conduct several times over the last 30 years or so.
I don't know what the posters here do. But, there was a good, lively discussion about it.
My DD#1 pitched D1 Juco ball, and went to the D1 Juco world series twice. Her former juco coach became a D1 coach. After juco, DD#1 became an NCAA D1 all-conference pitcher. Her max speed was 67MPH. She had a nasty drop ball, which was as good as any drop ball I've seen. (As I've said many times before, her biggest drawback was that she didn't have a good changeup.)
My DD#3 played hoops, scored something around 1400 points in HS, played D3 and won a national championship. So, I've been through the college sports mill three times.
My kids loved played college sports. It was amazing to watch them play.
As to softball pitching mechanics, there are people here more qualified than me. There are a lot of really good people here. I've learned a lot.
I have some expertise as to what it takes to help make a child into a successful college athlete. I've done it twice. I've also seen kids with more talent than my DD crash and burn.
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- Feb 22, 2013
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I was watching the Louisville - Florida St. Softball game last night on ESPN. There was a hitter at the plate for Louisville that had a 16 game hitting streak going on and a .376 batting average for the year. She had just got down in the count 0-2 and she stepped towards the dugout and looked out beyond the left field fence where there was a guy standing out there yelling instructions at the batter. It was so noticeable that the camera showed a feed of a guy sending signals to the batter and the two game commentators mentioned that it was the hitter's father trying to give instruction to his dd. The hitter's dad looked like he was giving signals similar to what a 3rd base coach would give to a hitter.
I immediately started to smile because it reminded me of this particular thread.
It isn't only the pitcher's parents who are coaching from the stands, it is also the hitter's parents who are playing the game in the stands.
Now, if the game commentators hadn't called attention to the guy in left field and the camera crew hadn't put the dad on TV and commented on the signs he was sending in from left field, there would have probably only been a handful of people in the stadium that knew that was taking place during a Division 1 Softball game with an advanced hitter.
I smiled at this sequence of events, because I have been guilty of yelling out "Powerline!", geared towards my dd, when she was pitching in college games.
I'm just glad that I'm not the only knucklehead in the stands or sitting out in left field.
I immediately started to smile because it reminded me of this particular thread.
It isn't only the pitcher's parents who are coaching from the stands, it is also the hitter's parents who are playing the game in the stands.
Now, if the game commentators hadn't called attention to the guy in left field and the camera crew hadn't put the dad on TV and commented on the signs he was sending in from left field, there would have probably only been a handful of people in the stadium that knew that was taking place during a Division 1 Softball game with an advanced hitter.
I smiled at this sequence of events, because I have been guilty of yelling out "Powerline!", geared towards my dd, when she was pitching in college games.
I'm just glad that I'm not the only knucklehead in the stands or sitting out in left field.
