My Two Cents

Although I respect the knowledge and passion for hitting exhibited by the frequent posters in this technical hitting forum, I must admit that this forum has been of limited value to me since shortly after Hitter/Howard left. I’m not pointing fingers or blaming anyone, just wanted to let you know what I previously found useful. I've helped coach my DD's U14/U16 travel team the last 2 years. Played D1 college BB, but my FP experience and knowledge is limited. I try to learn from others with more experience, watch as much college and elite FP as possible, and try to figure out how to effectively teach what I've learned. Howard offered up his version of What to Teach and How To Teach It – I found this TYPE of approach to be invaluable, whether I agreed with the approach itself or not. Additionally, to me, it was very relevant that his instructional approach was based on working with youth/young adult female FP players, not BB players, not MLBers.

The videos of Howard's drills and his detailed explanations of how to perform them benefited my DD and her teammates as well as numerous others based on responses I've read here. There is a distinction between asking constructive questions to gain an understanding as to how and why a drill is performed and that of repeated questioning that is purely critical in nature. If you don't agree with what someone's posted, please make it known, but don’t beat a dead horse. If you’re strongly opposed, post a video that shows how you teach your DD or FP students how to do it the way you think it should be done (ala Tewks). I love seeing Pujols, Mauer, and Griffey swing – but IMO there’s little relevance to the FP world. FFW posts of swings from the WCWS were great and much more applicable. I find it much more valid and tangible to teach DD to try to emulate Jen Yee than Albert P (hey that rhymes). Maybe it her swing wouldn’t be perfect, but if she accomplishes that initial goal, it would put her in the top < 1% of female FP hitters and she can work to improve from there. Is being the next Bustos, Yee etc. a realistic goal for most of our DDs? No, but it’s definitely more plausible and attainable than trying to be the first woman to play MLB and contend for the triple crown.

Personally, until I see all elite-level FP players and all MLB players with identical, carbon copy swings, I will continue to believe that while they are major commonalities, there's more than one way to swing the bat effectively and there's a multitude of ways to teach it.

Just my 0.02 - Greenmonsters

Well Said!

I for one really miss Howard the way he though outside the box and unique way he showed us and his students to feel different parts of the swing. Sometimes his post were a little over my head, but the videos he and straightleg posted put it all together for me, the short time some of the videos were up recently and as many times as I watched before I learned something new watching them this time.

For me the forum is lacking since his departure.

PM me if you haven't found where he posts.

He is great. I am considering going on the softball cruise, just to hear and see his presentation.

I respect someone that goes to the effort of posting videos and using their own name. I wish everyone was required to, even if we had to pay to register.

Hal Skinner is another one that posts his own stuff and stands by it.

I can't tell you the number of dads that will bring their kid to me for hitting lessons and then, just want me to reinforce what they have been telling them. They don't want to change the grip, the stance, or the elbows. They basically just want to pay me to stand on the rubber and shoot softballs for the kid to hit. They won't believe me when I tell them that learning to hit, takes hours of working in the garage (if you are in cold country) and hitting off a tee, correctly.

I can't teach a kid very much, yelling at her from 40 feet away, with the machine going. I can teach them, though, sitting out in my driveway, with them hitting into a net.

If you believe in something strongly, it's easy to react strongly to opposing views. I also miss Howard's contributions. It seemed he made genuine efforts to inform and help others. It seems as though many are just looking for an argument. Many of these arguments regarding the "correct" way to hit become very tedious and way too personal.

Thank you Greenmonsters for writing what I have been thinking. It's like you read my thoughts.

I think a big advantage of Howard's approach is understanding the benefit of teaching throw and swing together. Slaught also stresses this approach, Epstein less so (mainly in terms of "torque" position).

Howard's central point of departure appears to be Bustos swing, and she grew up playing baseball including overhand pitching.

There is more compelling evidence of "patterns" or what lau called absolutes and others call universals beyond the fact that "if you can throw you can hit" that has been well developed in golf as a model for what is possible in BB/FP.

Whatever the skill level, opportunities will lessen if overhand throw is poor, but at the same time, excellent high level throwing mechanics are still lacking at the highest levels of fastpitch.

The biggest bang for the buck is learning a good overhand throw pattern then try to build on this for swinging using available compatible programs like Howard, Slaught,Epstein.

Just because there are absolutes does not mean there is no variation, so in any case you need to sort out individual style vs universal technique (pattern). Being in pattern does not mean you will see "cookie cutter" results. rather, you need to learn how to see the underlying pattern and how it relates to results.

Inevitably, since this is a hitting forum, throwing info/knowledge gets short shrift. This is the major area of opportunity for all in fastpitch. An excellent start for throwing info includes Nyman ebooks for dummies, Ron Wolforth's athleticpitcher/pitchingcentral incorporating Nyman info, and BIOMECHANICBASEBLL by Hodge (wellphyt and five frame have access to the latter).

If you can throw, you can hit..... but do you know how to teach/learn to throw ?

Green, when trying to understand someone’s hitting system … Englishbey, HI, Epstein, etc., etc., etc. … it pays to immerse yourself in their teachings and learn everything you can about what they advocate.

You mentioned Howard in your post.

Have you contacted Howard to see if he has a private website where he fields questions about his teachings? Other hitting systems do this, and it greatly helps learn what they are specifically advocating.

The message board here is not moderated in a manner that advocates a particular hitting approach, and personally I find that refreshing … highly refreshing in fact. This is a place where thoughts, ideas and approaches can be merged, discussed and understood from various perspectives.

I think it’s great that people like SL wish to share drills. The implication is that he is sharing information to be helpful. People with a true intent to be helpful generally don’t mind fielding questions … after all, they are trying to be helpful … and when they don’t answer questions, then some can perceive other motives, such as commercialism or a desire to force feed their beliefs … not that this is the case here, but it isn’t completely clear why the desire to be helpful shuts off once questions are asked.

If you wish to immerse yourself into someone’s teachings … then do so. I’ve done that as best I can with several hitting methodologies. I feel I’ve gotten a lot out of it. I think you would as well. Simply contact the instructor of your choice, Howard in this case, and find out how best to immerge yourself in their teachings. I’ve even had instructors ask me if I’d moderate a website for them … which I’ve always said “no”, but the reality is many of them do desire to find a way to get their message out … so don’t be afraid to contact them.

Green … I wanted to respond to this portion separately.

Greenmonsters said:

The videos of Howard's drills and his detailed explanations of how to perform them benefited my DD and her teammates as well as numerous others based on responses I've read here.

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It is great that you’ve found a way to make progress developing hitters. That's what it is all about.

Having been at this several years I have my own thoughts on this topic. When I look back and ask myself what led to the biggest enhancement in terms of assisting hitters, it was my adoption of the Hanson Principle.

The Hanson Principle (… the one to use)

“Always compare what anybody tells you about the swing to slow motion clips of the best hitters in the world”.
-- Mark Hanson

Adopting this principle, religiously, resulted in taking more positive steps forward and less steps backwards. Stated differently, the principle assists with doing less stupid things and more smart things.

Quite frankly, I have found portions of Howard’s drills that don’t come close to satisfying the Hanson Principle. I’d go as far as to suggest that certain mismatches in the demonstrations, if taught and learned, would be harmful in terms of developing swings.

We are all responsible for the path we take. If the Hanson Principle isn’t for you, then that’s fine, and I respect your choice. The Hanson Prinicple is for me, and I think you should be able to respect that choice as well.

tom.guerry said:

I think a big advantage of Howard's approach is understanding the benefit of teaching throw and swing together. Slaught also stresses this approach, Epstein less so (mainly in terms of "torque" position).

If you can throw, you can hit..... but do you know how to teach/learn to throw ?

Click to expand...

Thoughtfull post, Tom. Here's what makes no sense to me. Why does my son (and most other boys) has good overhand throwing mechanics while my daughter (and most other girls) doesn't when they've been taught by the same coaches, myself included? They're the same age (not twins, triplets!) and played BB together age 5-9. My take away from this is that there's an inherent difference that gets overlooked and why I think its important to teach girls using female examples. Any thoughts on the phenomena?