Please Help with DD swing

petricca413 · Apr 6, 2014

We are NOT talking about a Major League hitter who can have hand movement and can release the bat with one hand after contact. We are talking about a 13 year-old hitter who is just learning how to react to different pitches and is trying to increase/maintain bat speed throughout the swing. Keeping her hands still will encourage her to use her body to generate power. Young hitters who have too much pre-swing hand movement tend to lead with their hands and not their body. This sacrifices critical bat speed. As for lettting go of the bat, young hitters release too early, which impacts bat speed and where the bat finishes. Major League hitters who release one hand do it without sacrificing power. I say teach the right technique first (holding on to the bat for the entire swing) and then allow her to release when she is older, if it is obvious that it isnt negatively impacting her power or consistency.

pstein · Apr 6, 2014

Honestly, the ball is gone. It doesn't matter if you hold on or release the top hand. Driving through the ball is a myth. If you're applying force beyond contact, then you're doing it wrong. Jack Mankin did a study that showed that the best hitters stopped generating force at contact.

softballphreak · Apr 6, 2014

Bjbkar said:
DD 13hitting-1 - YouTube

Just wondering if we are on the right track.

As best can be judged from one swing off of a tee I'd say she has a great swing. Lots of power.

As far as the hand movement, that is a good thing. Good for rhythm, good for not trying to move from a dead stop. Make sure it's the hands, not the barrel. What Candrea calls "small movement." Of course the barrel is going to react somewhat to the hand movement, but that's not a bad thing.

As far as releasing the hands, she does this well past the point it would make any difference in the swing. When the hands do come off the bat, for those who use that, they come off in time to allow the bat to extend further than it could if the top hand stayed on. Otherwise some other means has to be used for extension to avoid rolling over too soon. The top arm can't extend as far as the bottom arm. Therefore the hands have to roll over sooner than if the top hand is released. I've had girls be really surprised at how much farther they hit the ball when we do the hand-over drill, which is, in effect, a one-arm swing.

PS: Don't under estimate how capable kids are at learning a high-level swing. It's not necessarily an age thing.

mann · Apr 6, 2014

Its true, girls and boys will release the bat to soon. so?

You'll have to see the no hands home run gif to gain some understanding.

I would rather them release early, than roll out of the plane to soon.
I have clips of what happens.

Mlb players also hold on, and roll, well after extension. Youngsters, roll at contact, and into extension.

I will post some of my students who let go to early, but not until the ball is long gone.

Chezaré Sievers · Apr 6, 2014

When she strides she gets to a fairly athletic position. Give her two points that are super simple.
1. Stay athletic and keep your posture.
From the video, I can see her get a little bent over her waist which is why you see a more of a tilt from her head. A breakdown in posture results in a change in bat angle once you strike the ball which can result a long swing. In the baseball videos posted, you can see the athletic positioning and proper posture.

How does she react from being thrown out to in?

2. Stay short and extend down through the ball.

From the video, I can see her barrel top over the ball resulting in the ball having top spin rather than back spin. Backspin gives the ball lift resulting in more doubles and home runs and unfortunately sometimes pop ups. If you compare the video of your daughter and Miguel Cabrerra, you can see Cabrerra get to contact and continue to extend down. Compare the bat and ball separation in the two videos.

I hope this helps you and your daughter.

Chezaré Sievers · Apr 6, 2014

I totally agree with the hand movement. As they get older, the exaggerated hand movement disrupts the sequence of the swing. They start arm barring and having negative movement with the hands when they need positive.

What do you think about the softball barrel being smaller than the ball?

FiveFrameSwing · Apr 7, 2014

petricca413 said:
We are NOT talking about a Major League hitter who can have hand movement and can release the bat with one hand after contact. We are talking about a 13 year-old hitter who is just learning how to react to different pitches and is trying to increase/maintain bat speed throughout the swing. Keeping her hands still will encourage her to use her body to generate power. Young hitters who have too much pre-swing hand movement tend to lead with their hands and not their body. This sacrifices critical bat speed. As for lettting go of the bat, young hitters release too early, which impacts bat speed and where the bat finishes. Major League hitters who release one hand do it without sacrificing power. I say teach the right technique first (holding on to the bat for the entire swing) and then allow her to release when she is older, if it is obvious that it isnt negatively impacting her power or consistency.

We get it. What you teach doesn't agree with the Hanson Principle.

The Hanson Principle: "Always compare what anybody tells you about the swing to slow motion clips of the best hitters in the world".

Your excuse is pitiful. The truth is that it is even more important, not less important, for young hitters to learn flow, movement and rhythm. Keeping the hands still will not encourage a hitter to use the correct power source. What we see Cabrera doing above with his hands does not sacrifice critical bat speed, but instead leads to increased bat speed.

Greenmonsters · Apr 7, 2014

petricca413 said:
We are NOT talking about a Major League hitter who can have hand movement and can release the bat with one hand after contact. We are talking about a 13 year-old hitter who is just learning how to react to different pitches and is trying to increase/maintain bat speed throughout the swing. Keeping her hands still will encourage her to use her body to generate power. Young hitters who have too much pre-swing hand movement tend to lead with their hands and not their body. This sacrifices critical bat speed. As for lettting go of the bat, young hitters release too early, which impacts bat speed and where the bat finishes. Major League hitters who release one hand do it without sacrificing power. I say teach the right technique first (holding on to the bat for the entire swing) and then allow her to release when she is older, if it is obvious that it isnt negatively impacting her power or consistency.

I've heard better hitting advice from a petrock than petricca413.

bleacherdad · Apr 7, 2014

leave it alone

softballphreak said:
As best can be judged from one swing off of a tee I'd say she has a great swing. Lots of power.

As far as the hand movement, that is a good thing. Good for rhythm, good for not trying to move from a dead stop. Make sure it's the hands, not the barrel. What Candrea calls "small movement." Of course the barrel is going to react somewhat to the hand movement, but that's not a bad thing.

As far as releasing the hands, she does this well past the point it would make any difference in the swing. When the hands do come off the bat, for those who use that, they come off in time to allow the bat to extend further than it could if the top hand stayed on. Otherwise some other means has to be used for extension to avoid rolling over too soon. The top arm can't extend as far as the bottom arm. Therefore the hands have to roll over sooner than if the top hand is released. I've had girls be really surprised at how much farther they hit the ball when we do the hand-over drill, which is, in effect, a one-arm swing.

PS: Don't under estimate how capable kids are at learning a high-level swing. It's not necessarily an age thing.

She absolutely does have a great swing. For a 13yo she is so far ahead of where you'd expect her to be. Your going to fight the urge to change things and slowly screw up her swing. The problem for you as I see it is she is at the point where mechanics are very good and the mental edge should be addressed now. However, is she does not move to a higher level in summer ball, she will not excel. In other words, she most likely needs a bigger challenge.

The advice regarding 2 hands on the bat and early hand movement is just plain wrong.
SB gives some good insight here in his post.
JMHO.

Eric F · Apr 7, 2014

Chezaré Sievers said:
2. Stay short and extend down through the ball.

No. Please don't. This cue encourages a downward barrel path which is NOT what we want to see, and is not what we see in top hitters. Trying to impart backspin by hitting down on the ball is a fallacy.

I agree that the hand path should be short (out from the rear shoulder), but the barrel pivots around the hands (starting rearward first), and should contact the ball with a slightly upward angle of attack, matching (or very closely matching) the trajectory of the pitch. A downward barrel path creates a single point of contact, which requires the hitter's timing to be perfect to hit the ball solidly. A barrel that is longer on the plane of the pitch gives the hitter a much larger window of time to make contact.

I'm not seeing a downward barrel path at contact...

Please Help with DD swing

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