Confusion on ASA ruling on blocking home plate

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Jun 16, 2017
3
0
I read the ASA rule book to educate myself on girls fastpitch u12, and googled a bunch and cannot find a clear answer, hopefully someone here can help give me a rule clarification.

We had a situation in a game today where a runner was running home as the ball was being thrown back from outfield. Ball is thrown in to pitcher and she starts to throw but runner is already approaching home. Catcher is standing right on the plate without the ball waiting for the ball from pitcher. Runner steps on side edge of the plate and with the momentum runs into catcher and bounces off. Doesn't lean in or extend arms, but the catcher does put out an arm into the runner (ball still not to catcher). The catcher doesn't get knocked over or even move at all but smaller runner tumbles to ground behind catcher after impact. Umpire calls runner out for not avoiding contact. In this league they go by ASA and no "must slide" rule.

Is it obstruction by the catcher or is the runner out?

To me it seems the rules state that the catcher must have the ball or it is obstruction. One blog I read said the runner would score as she touched the plate first, but the umpire may eject her if it was malicious. What is the real deal?
 
Jan 7, 2013
158
18
Runner safe if she touched the plate first. The question is if she made a malicious attempt to plow the catcher.


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Jun 22, 2008
3,731
113
USA softball has no provisions for calling an out for not avoiding contact. Malicious contact is a term used in NFHS which does provide for calling an out if the umpire judges the contact meets the definition of malicious.

To answer your question, if the catcher was standing on the plate without the ball and hindered the runner accessing it then it should have been ruled obstruction. USA has no provisions for calling an out so the run should have counted and if the umpire felt the runner was unsportsmanlike in initiating the contact then the runner can be ejected.

The umpire may have been thinking about the crash rule which was not applicable in this situation. The crash rule requires the runner to avoid running into the fielder if they have possession of the ball and are waiting to make a tag. In this situation, the catcher neither had the ball or waiting to make a tag.
 
Dec 11, 2010
4,713
113
Okay this comes up over and over and over again. And I see outs constantly lost because catchers are standing in front of the plate and they catch the ball and try to reach back and tag.

What is the 2017 best practice for positioning a catcher to receive a throw? I know what the 1960 one is and it doesn't look like it works to me. NECC people let's hear it!
 
Sep 24, 2013
696
0
Midwest
As always Comp is absolutely right.

Westwind the game has put an emphasis on the runner and as such put the catcher at a disadvantage. I don't know what you can do when you don't have possession of the ball but stand in front and swing the tag.

Now if you have the ball the pressure is on the runner........
 
Dec 11, 2010
4,713
113
Keep in mind that I know zip about catching and have never caught but would this work: catcher is on backstop side of plate with plate between thrower and c. When the ball comes the catcher is naturally moving forward and catches and is already moving toward the side of the plate the runner is coming from. Can you picture that? Might be a way to get plowed though.
 
Nov 26, 2010
4,784
113
Michigan
Keep in mind that I know zip about catching and have never caught but would this work: catcher is on backstop side of plate with plate between thrower and c. When the ball comes the catcher is naturally moving forward and catches and is already moving toward the side of the plate the runner is coming from. Can you picture that? Might be a way to get plowed though.

I always taught them to stand with their left foot on the third baseline. Most runners are coming from the foul side so this gives the runner at least half the plate to run to, and it putts the catcher in a spot where she can field the throw and easily tag the runner. But with no throw they should move that left foot off the line and step toward the pitcher.
 

Strike2

Allergic to BS
Nov 14, 2014
2,044
113
Wrong call by the umpire. In this and any other situation where there's the potential for a play, the runner should slide. I know...nothing says that sliding is required. However, in this situation, if the runner SLIDES into Home and the catcher is standing there (with or without the ball), there is no possible penalty on the runner unless it's an obvious "steel cleats up" attempt to injure. Take the opportunity for a bad call out of the umpire's hands whenever possible. If a runner is called out in that situation, that is when you stop the game and call for the head umpire / TD for a discussion about rule interpretation.
 
Jun 16, 2017
3
0
USA softball has no provisions for calling an out for not avoiding contact. Malicious contact is a term used in NFHS which does provide for calling an out if the umpire judges the contact meets the definition of malicious.

To answer your question, if the catcher was standing on the plate without the ball and hindered the runner accessing it then it should have been ruled obstruction. USA has no provisions for calling an out so the run should have counted and if the umpire felt the runner was unsportsmanlike in initiating the contact then the runner can be ejected.

The umpire may have been thinking about the crash rule which was not applicable in this situation. The crash rule requires the runner to avoid running into the fielder if they have possession of the ball and are waiting to make a tag. In this situation, the catcher neither had the ball or waiting to make a tag.

This is what I thought. We stopped the game appealed and the head wouldn't discuss the issue, after the game I asked them to find the rule, and they could not but stuck to their guns. I sent an email to their office to have the rules enforce, we will see what their reply is.

Normally I would chalk it up to just a bad call, but this league it happens too much and some of the situations are going to create injuries and potential legal issues.
 

obbay

Banned
Aug 21, 2008
2,199
0
Boston, MA
Runner steps on side edge of the plate and with the momentum runs into catcher and bounces off. Doesn't lean in or extend arms, but the catcher does put out an arm into the runner (ball still not to catcher). The catcher doesn't get knocked over or even move at all but smaller runner tumbles to ground behind catcher after impact.

Is there a rule about malicious contact by the defense? like on that video of the girl running home and the catcher drops her shoulder and takes out the runner with no play.

I know there's a rule against applying a faketag, but I don't remember which rule set that was in(-probably LL)

 
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