Catcher throwing from their knees

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Nov 12, 2009
365
18
Kansas City
Putting the stopwatches to this throw shows a .93 second ball handling time. This is very good for her age and usually will yield a sub-two second throw. The 2:16 pop time is due to the arched path the ball is taking. (As noted by PC) The high arched throw is necessary due to the velocity of the throw. This is still a very respectable time for a 13 year old girl.

[video=vimeo;53188537]https://vimeo.com/53188537[/video]



Everyone jumps on this issue not because we are thinking baseball, but because when young girls attempt this type of throw too early (age/body maturity-wise), they run the risk of shoulder, arm & elbow injury. I started with a 10U catcher two weeks ago and her coach wants her throwing from her knees by spring. She simply has not matured enough to make this type of throw. I have worked with a 10U catcher that you could mistake for 17, but this type of maturity is rare for a 10 year old. I typically ask that my catchers work on their throws, be able to demonstrate the proper technique for throwing coming out of their runner-on stance and be able to throw at a minimum velocity before we start working on throwing from the knees. This type of throw requires all the velocity to be generated from the torso, shoulders and arms. Taking the legs out of the throw puts added stress to the upper body.

With catchers it is important to think long term. I have 5 adult female friends who caught in H/S. They range in age from mid-20's to 50's. Four of them have already had at least one knee replaced. (Including the one in her mid-20's) Those like myself who work only with catchers teach multiple-stances, certain methods of coming up out of a block to throw, specific methods of receiving, tag plays and other techniques with an eye on our catcher's safety and overall health. One of the first things I discuss with new catchers is that we will work on taking care of his or her body, showing ways to reduce stress to knees in stance and arms while throwing. I don't want to see a one of them get hurt or use techniques that will damage or deteriorate their body over time. This position is hard enough on a catcher's body, and they will suffer wear and tear from it. But we care enough to make every attempt to reduce the wear and tear they endure.

Sorry to pull out the soap-box, throwing from the knees is a great tool to have in one's arsenal. The stopwatch shows that the vast majority of catchers will throw just as quick or quicker utilizing proper techniques (and their legs) coming up to throw....
 
Last edited:

Greenmonsters

Wannabe Duck Boat Owner
Feb 21, 2009
6,168
38
New England
Putting the stopwatches to this throw shows a .93 second ball handling time. This is very good for her age and usually will yield a sub-two second throw. The 2:16 pop time is due to the arched path the ball is taking. (As noted by PC) The high arched throw is necessary due to the velocity of the throw. This is still a very respectable time for a 13 year old girl.

[video=vimeo;53188537]https://vimeo.com/53188537[/video]





Everyone jumps on this issue not because we are thinking baseball, but because when young girls attempt this type of throw too early (age/body maturity-wise), they run the risk of shoulder, arm & elbow injury. I started with a 10U catcher two weeks ago and her coach wants her throwing from her knees by spring. She simply has not matured enough to make this type of throw. I have worked with a 10U catcher that you could mistake for 17, but this type of maturity is rare for a 10 year old. I typically ask that my catchers work on their throws, be able to demonstrate the proper technique for throwing coming out of their runner-on stance and be able to throw at a minimum velocity before we start working on throwing from the knees. This type of throw requires all the velocity to be generated from the torso, shoulders and arms. Taking the legs out of the throw puts added stress to the upper body.

With catchers it is important to think long term. I have 5 adult female friends who caught in H/S. They range in age from mid-20's to 50's. Four of them have already had at least one knee replaced. (Including the one in her mid-20's) Those like myself who work only with catchers teach multiple-stances, certain methods of coming up out of a block to throw, specific methods of receiving, tag plays and other techniques with an eye on our catcher's safety and overall health. One of the first things I discuss with new catchers is that we will work on taking care of his or her body, showing ways to reduce stress to knees in stance and arms while throwing. I don't want to see a one of them get hurt or use techniques that will damage or deteriorate their body over time. This position is hard enough on a catcher's body, and they will suffer wear and tear from it. But we care enough to make every attempt to reduce the wear and tear they endure.

Sorry to pull out the soap-box, throwing from the knees is a great tool to have in one's arsenal. The stopwatch shows that the vast majority of catchers will throw just as quick or quicker utilizing proper techniques (and their legs) coming up to throw....

Excellent post, Chaz. Two points I want to add. First, the 13 yo in the video is not your average sized 13 yo or, at 5'10", not even your average sized 18+ yo, so what she can do is not realistic to expect of most 13 year olds. When that 13 yo matures and her core and arm get stronger, no doubt her pop time easily will be sub 2.0 and when it does, I'd use the stopwatch to confirm whether she's quicker from the knees or, where I'd put my money, conventionally.

Second, many catchers, whether they throw conventionally or from their knees, take a stance with runners on that's more advantageous for throwing out potential stealers that limits their ability to block balls in the dirt effectively, which, IMO, is their primary task. So regardless of throwing method, the stance has to be blocking oriented first or the net effect is negative i.e., more bases given up due to PB/WP then additional outs potentially achieved on attempted steals.
 
Nov 12, 2009
365
18
Kansas City
Does anyone have any videos of Fastpitch catchers throwing from their knees?

This video lesson has been available through the New England Catching Camp and is broken down step by step. Dave did caution catchers on when and how to use this type of throw. I didn't see it in the store just now but give Jay a call at (603) 882-8981.
 
Oct 19, 2009
639
0
I'm no catching expert but don't see why this would be required given that the vast majority of high level catchers do it standing up. One thing this site drills into me all the time is don't reinvent the wheel look at the very best and copy.

I think a snap throw down to first for a pick off would be the obvious exception, third is closer so the extra time from standing up is not really that big of a waste since the distance is shorter and a good throw gets there faster than second plus going to third you also have to worry about clearing the batter so I don't think you would need it for third either.

The best application for this is where a runner on first goes two on a pitch in the dirt. Catcher is already on her knees blocking and losing time fielding the pitch. Best chance of getting the out is to go ahead and throw from the knees.
 
Nov 12, 2009
365
18
Kansas City
M/H, I apologize, but have to disagree. Once the catcher has her knees on the ground and is facing forward in block position, she is short on muscle to propel the ball. Only the shoulder and arm are left. Ideally the ball is caught in runner on stance, catcher sets to throw as she pivots hips and drops to knee. The catcher can then utilize body weight going forward in the throw as well as hips, torso, arm and shoulder in the throw.

High School ball is done in Missouri and I am getting some of my older catchers back for tune ups and instruction. I started working with one of my 16U catchers last night on throwing from her knees to first. She worked the technique and we timed throws to first coming up out of runner on stance and dropping to her knees to throw. Throws from the knees were clocked at 2.03, 1.81 and 1.75 seconds. Standing throws were clocked at 1.81, 1.87 and 1.75 seconds. We are still refining her throwing technique when dropping to her knees. We discussed the times being similar and which method she prefers. (She prefers dropping to her knee when throwing to first) I hope to have more to report in the coming weeks and some video to boot....
-Chaz @ ACC

317871_290867700933220_1599230124_n.jpg
 
Oct 19, 2009
639
0
M/H, I apologize, but have to disagree. Once the catcher has her knees on the ground and is facing forward in block position, she is short on muscle to propel the ball. Only the shoulder and arm are left. Ideally the ball is caught in runner on stance, catcher sets to throw as she pivots hips and drops to knee. The catcher can then utilize body weight going forward in the throw as well as hips, torso, arm and shoulder in the throw.

High School ball is done in Missouri and I am getting some of my older catchers back for tune ups and instruction. I started working with one of my 16U catchers last night on throwing from her knees to first. She worked the technique and we timed throws to first coming up out of runner on stance and dropping to her knees to throw. Throws from the knees were clocked at 2.03, 1.81 and 1.75 seconds. Standing throws were clocked at 1.81, 1.87 and 1.75 seconds. We are still refining her throwing technique when dropping to her knees. We discussed the times being similar and which method she prefers. (She prefers dropping to her knee when throwing to first) I hope to have more to report in the coming weeks and some video to boot....
-Chaz @ ACC

View attachment 2782

Am I to understand that these times from standing throws were from pitches in the dirt that they had dropped to block? In other words, they had already dropped to their knees, cleanly fielded the pitch in the dirt, then stood back up and got the throw down all under two seconds????
 
Nov 12, 2009
365
18
Kansas City
Am I to understand that these times from standing throws were from pitches in the dirt that they had dropped to block? In other words, they had already dropped to their knees, cleanly fielded the pitch in the dirt, then stood back up and got the throw down all under two seconds????

M/H, No, I am sorry if I gave that impression. The first paragraph referred to throwing from a block position. After a catcher is in block position on the ground, (on their knees with shoulders forward) Should they attempt to throw, they can only use their arm in the throw.

423163_369923736360949_863504145_n.jpg

They have little or no muscle to put behind the throw. We work a different method in recovering blocked balls on the ground and make the throw. I did not time this type of recovery for comparison...

Later paragraph compare starting from a runner-on stance and throwing stepping forward as opposed to dropping to the knees and throwing.

Snapshot 1 (11-17-2012 7-03 PM).jpg VS KP 470315_445539008799421_1978181303_o.jpg

Throwing times in the latter comparison are very close. I hope to offer some video in the near future as my catchers have additional time to work on this throw. Sorry for the confusion.
-Chaz
 
Sep 14, 2009
25
0
Australian catchers generally do it. It's like the video of the young girl that Amy posted, you're doing the same motion, but with your knees instead of your feet.

The reason it might not be taught in America is because a lot of the coaches are men who are thinking in baseball terms. We are not playing baseball. We have a lot less time in softball to throw the out. In baseball they have an extra 30 feet (correct me if I'm wrong, never had much to do with baseball) to run, so the catcher has more time.

True, base distance is shorter, but the girls can't lead off either, Cant leave base until ball leaves the hand of the pitcher and the throwing distance is also shorter. My daughter (one in video posted in this thread) probably throws from knees and from feet about 50/50.
 

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