18U showcase team in NJ. Our catchers call their own game.
Coaches Vs. Catchers Calling Pitches
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- May 17, 2012
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In my experience (most) catchers don't want to call the game exclusively.
I have yet to have a catcher ask/demand (before accepting a position on the team) that they call pitches exclusively.
I assume that most believe it will be a collaboration between coach/pitcher/catcher.
This is just never an issue...
Coaches have egos and dont want to give control over to the catcher. Catchers have the best view of the batter's setup and practice swings and even her face. Is the batter nervous or confident, focused or scattered?
This is good stuff here:
Amanda Freed: How to Set-up A Batter
I think the strategy of setting up a batter is becoming a lost art. There is a difference between mixing pitches and setting up a batter. When you set a batter up, you are actually setting the batter up to chase the pitch you want them to. If you set a batter up correctly, you can get them out on any pitch, even if it's their "favorite pitch."
If you are neither a pitcher or catcher, this may not seem like it applies to you, but I am going to tell you how I would analyze you before and during your at-bat.
Pitchers and catchers, what do you look for?
On Deck: What does her swing tell you?
1) Is it long and loopy? Slow hands?
-Think jam her inside and up. Chances are she cannot get her barrel around on time.
Be careful with change up and away pitches. It is easier for someone with slow hands to get her barrel on an outside pitch.
2) Does she swing on a high plane or a low plane (meaning, does her barrel stay level by her shoulders or drop down below her waist)?
-If it's on a high plane, keep the ball low, preferable low and in. Chances are she will have a difficult time dropping her barrel to hit the low inside hard.
You're goal is to get her to hit it off of her shin. Mean I know, but that's the game.
3) When she's getting ready to get into the box, does she look anxious and a little tense? Is she really fidgety?:
- If she is really high-strung getting into the box, she is probably pretty impatient. I would definitely try and throw her off balance with change ups. Either start her off with a change up or something tight in, make her pull it foul. Don't paint the black on this pitch, aim for her hands. She just may have enough adrenaline in her to take it over the fence if you hang it. A GOOD inside pitch thrown in the right situation is extremely difficult to hit hard and fair.
When she steps into the box, look for…
1) Foot positioning.
- Open stance: (front foot towards third if it's a righty, first for a lefty)
Chances are she is either having trouble keeping her front side in on the pitch, or she is protecting herself against the inside. Check to see if her body becomes closed at the time of the pitch. If she gets closed, JAM HER IN. If she gets the barrel on the ball she will most likely jam herself, or pull it foul.
Closed stance: (front foot towards the plate) I would live inside on her. She is most likely looking for the outside pitch and protecting herself from getting beat on it. Go down and in, up and in, and make her fist herself out to the shortstop. Just watch to make sure that she doesn't step in the bucket when she strides. But again, in this case, a good inside pitch will still be difficult for her to hit hard and fair.
2) Hand positioning:
- Low hands: Probably swings fairly level, but again, check on deck or warm-up swings.
Be careful with the flat plane pitches (screw and curve) unless they have some up and down movement. Will probably have better success on the rise ball as well.
- High hands: I'm guessing she's pretty loopy so I'm going to jam her tight to start off and find out what the plane of her swing looks like because it could really go either way. She may have a straight rise ball swing, or a long, looping drop ball swing.
3) Box positioning:
- Front of the box: If she's in the front, I think that means she anxious. She is trying to bring more pitches into her strike zone. I'd go with jamming her and working in the change up.
- Back of the box: She is either not seeing the ball well, or she is very patient and wants you to bring the ball into the strike zone. Work ahead of the batter (first pitch strike) and go with your best moving pitches.
There are so many other tips that you learn from watching and studying batters.
As I go through the pitches that I would likely throw in certain situations, it is important to remember that this doesn't mean that you abandon every other pitch and just stick to one or two. It just means that we've identified a "weakness" and we've got to expose it.
There are many situations where you learn to throw to the batter and not the plate. What I mean by this is if the batter is standing a fairly good distance off the plate, of course you automatically assume that she will have a difficult time reaching the outside pitch and is probably looking inside. What I am going to do is start her off outside and get a strike (hopefully?) Let's say she swings but looks pretty bad. The next pitch I am going to go right back at it, just a little further out and see if she'll bite. She leans in, but takes the ball off the outside corner. Now I've got her leaning to the outside. I know she doesn't like that pitch but I've got her thinking that I'm living on the out. She moves just a little closer to the plate, not much, and now I am throwing to her hands. Not to hit her obviously, but I'm throwing just below her hands through her belly button. I know she's off the plate and looking to protect the inside but I'm throwing to her, not the strike zone. She will do one of three things. She'll turn on it hard and pull it foul, she'll jam herself into an out, or I'll force her back off the plate a little more. Remember a good inside pitch is difficult to hit hard and fair. Good inside does not necessarily mean a good strike. Now, I go back out to finish her off. Sounds like fun, huh?
On the other hand. There are situations where you don't even need to waste time or pitches. You start a girl off low and in and she fouls it between her legs. Clearly she had a difficult time with that pitch so now you go with the same pitch, just a little further in and a little lower. This is not a waste pitch. You want her to see it as the same pitch. She takes a not so pretty cut over the top, again. Now she's frustrated and thinking, "gotta protect," so you go right back at it, a little lower and a little farther in, maybe almost in the dirt. If she doesn't go for it, you've definitely got her thinking, and have set her up for the out, or change up.
We joke out here that there is a 90/10 rule when it comes to listening. 10% of everything you hear is actually heard and processed. The other 90% just goes in one ear and out the other. So if you remember anything from this article, I want this to be your 10%. Every pitch you throw must serve a purpose. For example, if I know absolutely nothing about a batter as she steps into the box, I've got to use that first pitch to gather as much information about her as possible. I like to start with a good inside pitch or a change up. Remember how we define that good inside pitch, and I like to keep the change up low and away. That is how I am able to gather the most information. If you throw a pitch right down the middle, or even on the inside part of the black and the batter does nothing but watches it, what have you learned?
Throw every pitch with a purpose.
Set the batter up to hit, or miss, what you want. Guess what, sometimes it slips or you make a bad decision. Big deal. Learn from it but keep plugging along. Remember, these are all just suggestions. I know not everyone has "all the tools" but you can make the best possible situation out of what you have! Take control of your own game and you'll be more confident.
Amanda
This is good stuff here:
Amanda Freed: How to Set-up A Batter
I think the strategy of setting up a batter is becoming a lost art. There is a difference between mixing pitches and setting up a batter. When you set a batter up, you are actually setting the batter up to chase the pitch you want them to. If you set a batter up correctly, you can get them out on any pitch, even if it's their "favorite pitch."
If you are neither a pitcher or catcher, this may not seem like it applies to you, but I am going to tell you how I would analyze you before and during your at-bat.
Pitchers and catchers, what do you look for?
On Deck: What does her swing tell you?
1) Is it long and loopy? Slow hands?
-Think jam her inside and up. Chances are she cannot get her barrel around on time.
Be careful with change up and away pitches. It is easier for someone with slow hands to get her barrel on an outside pitch.
2) Does she swing on a high plane or a low plane (meaning, does her barrel stay level by her shoulders or drop down below her waist)?
-If it's on a high plane, keep the ball low, preferable low and in. Chances are she will have a difficult time dropping her barrel to hit the low inside hard.
You're goal is to get her to hit it off of her shin. Mean I know, but that's the game.
3) When she's getting ready to get into the box, does she look anxious and a little tense? Is she really fidgety?:
- If she is really high-strung getting into the box, she is probably pretty impatient. I would definitely try and throw her off balance with change ups. Either start her off with a change up or something tight in, make her pull it foul. Don't paint the black on this pitch, aim for her hands. She just may have enough adrenaline in her to take it over the fence if you hang it. A GOOD inside pitch thrown in the right situation is extremely difficult to hit hard and fair.
When she steps into the box, look for…
1) Foot positioning.
- Open stance: (front foot towards third if it's a righty, first for a lefty)
Chances are she is either having trouble keeping her front side in on the pitch, or she is protecting herself against the inside. Check to see if her body becomes closed at the time of the pitch. If she gets closed, JAM HER IN. If she gets the barrel on the ball she will most likely jam herself, or pull it foul.
Closed stance: (front foot towards the plate) I would live inside on her. She is most likely looking for the outside pitch and protecting herself from getting beat on it. Go down and in, up and in, and make her fist herself out to the shortstop. Just watch to make sure that she doesn't step in the bucket when she strides. But again, in this case, a good inside pitch will still be difficult for her to hit hard and fair.
2) Hand positioning:
- Low hands: Probably swings fairly level, but again, check on deck or warm-up swings.
Be careful with the flat plane pitches (screw and curve) unless they have some up and down movement. Will probably have better success on the rise ball as well.
- High hands: I'm guessing she's pretty loopy so I'm going to jam her tight to start off and find out what the plane of her swing looks like because it could really go either way. She may have a straight rise ball swing, or a long, looping drop ball swing.
3) Box positioning:
- Front of the box: If she's in the front, I think that means she anxious. She is trying to bring more pitches into her strike zone. I'd go with jamming her and working in the change up.
- Back of the box: She is either not seeing the ball well, or she is very patient and wants you to bring the ball into the strike zone. Work ahead of the batter (first pitch strike) and go with your best moving pitches.
There are so many other tips that you learn from watching and studying batters.
As I go through the pitches that I would likely throw in certain situations, it is important to remember that this doesn't mean that you abandon every other pitch and just stick to one or two. It just means that we've identified a "weakness" and we've got to expose it.
There are many situations where you learn to throw to the batter and not the plate. What I mean by this is if the batter is standing a fairly good distance off the plate, of course you automatically assume that she will have a difficult time reaching the outside pitch and is probably looking inside. What I am going to do is start her off outside and get a strike (hopefully?) Let's say she swings but looks pretty bad. The next pitch I am going to go right back at it, just a little further out and see if she'll bite. She leans in, but takes the ball off the outside corner. Now I've got her leaning to the outside. I know she doesn't like that pitch but I've got her thinking that I'm living on the out. She moves just a little closer to the plate, not much, and now I am throwing to her hands. Not to hit her obviously, but I'm throwing just below her hands through her belly button. I know she's off the plate and looking to protect the inside but I'm throwing to her, not the strike zone. She will do one of three things. She'll turn on it hard and pull it foul, she'll jam herself into an out, or I'll force her back off the plate a little more. Remember a good inside pitch is difficult to hit hard and fair. Good inside does not necessarily mean a good strike. Now, I go back out to finish her off. Sounds like fun, huh?
On the other hand. There are situations where you don't even need to waste time or pitches. You start a girl off low and in and she fouls it between her legs. Clearly she had a difficult time with that pitch so now you go with the same pitch, just a little further in and a little lower. This is not a waste pitch. You want her to see it as the same pitch. She takes a not so pretty cut over the top, again. Now she's frustrated and thinking, "gotta protect," so you go right back at it, a little lower and a little farther in, maybe almost in the dirt. If she doesn't go for it, you've definitely got her thinking, and have set her up for the out, or change up.
We joke out here that there is a 90/10 rule when it comes to listening. 10% of everything you hear is actually heard and processed. The other 90% just goes in one ear and out the other. So if you remember anything from this article, I want this to be your 10%. Every pitch you throw must serve a purpose. For example, if I know absolutely nothing about a batter as she steps into the box, I've got to use that first pitch to gather as much information about her as possible. I like to start with a good inside pitch or a change up. Remember how we define that good inside pitch, and I like to keep the change up low and away. That is how I am able to gather the most information. If you throw a pitch right down the middle, or even on the inside part of the black and the batter does nothing but watches it, what have you learned?
Throw every pitch with a purpose.
Set the batter up to hit, or miss, what you want. Guess what, sometimes it slips or you make a bad decision. Big deal. Learn from it but keep plugging along. Remember, these are all just suggestions. I know not everyone has "all the tools" but you can make the best possible situation out of what you have! Take control of your own game and you'll be more confident.
Amanda
- Apr 28, 2019
- 1,423
- 83
I watched a 2019 16U PGF tourney and there is a team from the Chicago area that is transitioning into having the kids call their own pitches.
This Org is very good/competitive they win Championships at high levels in all age groups. Their name escapes me at the moment.
Anyway, the pitcher was calling out a three number code to the catcher before most pitches not all pitches. I’m guessing maybe if she was going to double-up on a pitch she didn’t call it out a 2nd time. Seems like it would be an easy tell for the competition to pick-up on but really not sure.
95%+ of the coaches have never called a game in their lives, never caught or pitched, and have zero live feedback from the game, so why should they call pitches? They bring nothing to the table......
Its all about ego. I've heard "did you see that pitch i called " way too many times. You'll never hear " i told her to throw that pitch and it got jacked to the adjacent zip code". It's always you missed you spot. Its laughable. It's also sad that parents put up with it
Its all about ego. I've heard "did you see that pitch i called " way too many times. You'll never hear " i told her to throw that pitch and it got jacked to the adjacent zip code". It's always you missed you spot. Its laughable. It's also sad that parents put up with it
Part of the reason catchers don’t call games or demand to do so is because they’re not taught to do so. It’s also not expected.
it’s a chicken or the egg thing with college isn’t it. What came first, coaches calling or coaches getting players who didn’t know how to?
I’ve pitched for 20 years and have never had a coach call games. Catchers are taught from a young age how to actually catch.
it’s a chicken or the egg thing with college isn’t it. What came first, coaches calling or coaches getting players who didn’t know how to?
I’ve pitched for 20 years and have never had a coach call games. Catchers are taught from a young age how to actually catch.
radness
Possibilities & Opportunities!
- Dec 13, 2019
- 7,270
- 113
Everyone on the team should understand calling pitches as it relates to setting up batters.
Helps when on defense and offense.
Catchers have best view and watch pitchers during warms ups to evaluate whats working that day. Generally have an interactive role with pitchers to focus on working together.
Communicating through each inning.
They can be a resource behind the plate to call pitches.
Coaches, if your intending to call pitches, please pay more attention to pitcher's warming up befor games!
Please pay attention to including feedback from the P&C throughout the game so everyone can work together.
Helps when on defense and offense.
Catchers have best view and watch pitchers during warms ups to evaluate whats working that day. Generally have an interactive role with pitchers to focus on working together.
Communicating through each inning.
They can be a resource behind the plate to call pitches.
Coaches, if your intending to call pitches, please pay more attention to pitcher's warming up befor games!
Please pay attention to including feedback from the P&C throughout the game so everyone can work together.
Cannonball
Ex "Expert"
- Feb 25, 2009
- 4,881
- 113
Interesting. Why do you think that percentage is so high?
He was unique in that he wanted the kids to understand why they were doing something. All the coaches that came after him were good but they typically just told the players what they wanted. FWIW, he is now a D1 assistant so I guess his strategy worked.
radness
Possibilities & Opportunities!
- Dec 13, 2019
- 7,270
- 113
Can share see coaches calling pitches who dont watch pitchers warm ups on game days. Yikes!
As far as who calls pitches topic...
Coaches will argue amongst themselves who should
HC, AC or PDC (pitchers dad coach) some never considering the catcher.
Imo this simply could be what a coach see's their roles to be.
Are they running the game or teaching it?!
Some coaches tend to
micromanage every detail.
(Whether they recognize it or not.)
Simply not utilizing all resources.
Wouldnt always consider its ego
as much as its different styles.
Probably theres a giant group of assistant coaches that have great suggestions that never get listened to or applied.
This roles over into other things like Head Coach not paying attention to whats really going on and coaching the game in their head, not the one on the field.
"just do what i tell you to do because i said to"
As far as who calls pitches topic...
Coaches will argue amongst themselves who should
HC, AC or PDC (pitchers dad coach) some never considering the catcher.
Imo this simply could be what a coach see's their roles to be.
Are they running the game or teaching it?!
Some coaches tend to
micromanage every detail.
(Whether they recognize it or not.)
Simply not utilizing all resources.
Wouldnt always consider its ego
as much as its different styles.
Probably theres a giant group of assistant coaches that have great suggestions that never get listened to or applied.
This roles over into other things like Head Coach not paying attention to whats really going on and coaching the game in their head, not the one on the field.
"just do what i tell you to do because i said to"
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