What happened to ASA/USA Gold Nationals?

So my oldest DD played and made
It to OK City for 18 Gold Nationals 7 years ago, and PGF was still new then, but picking up steam. Now youngest DD team’s coach has been trying for PGF for the last couple of years, and they finally made it this year, so we are playing now in SoCal. Out of curiosity I looked up 18G and 16G USA and was shocked to see how few teams are penciled in.
What happened there? 360 teams in PGF 18s and 16s combined, but less than 80 for USA 18G and 16G combined? What did I miss?

PGF has done a very good job marketing themselves into being the tournament that everyone wants to be at. They also host it in a place that people want to go to - hard to beat So Cal beaches in the summer.

Eric F said:

... hard to beat So Cal beaches in the summer.

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Or the fall, winter or spring.

: )

Around here, USA Softball is still the big player, but USSSA is trying to make some inlets. I believe there is some PGF an hour or two to the north, but I’m not sure.

There is a 12u National in my area this weekend. Their team count is way down (less than 1/2) compared to the last time they hosted it (a few years ago?).

One of my issues with USA (from the umpire side) is that leadership around here gets bent out of shape if you work other sanctions. They are quick to remind you that you are an independent contractor when it suits them though.

The Man In Blue said:

Around here, USA Softball is still the big player, but USSSA is trying to make some inlets. I believe there is some PGF an hour or two to the north, but I’m not sure.

There is a 12u National in my area this weekend. Their team count is way down (less than 1/2) compared to the last time they hosted it (a few years ago?).

One of my issues with USA (from the umpire side) is that leadership around here gets bent out of shape if you work other sanctions. They are quick to remind you that you are an independent contractor when it suits them though.

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Where's your area?

USA is by far the dominant org for rec ball in So Cal, but in TB it's almost non-existent. PGF, TCS, USSA, and even little AFA have more presence for TB tournaments.

The Man In Blue said:

One of my issues with USA (from the umpire side) is that leadership around here gets bent out of shape if you work other sanctions. They are quick to remind you that you are an independent contractor when it suits them though.

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And therein lies the problem with USA softball. The still feel they are relevant in the world of girls fastpitch softball. It's the same thing with the leadership in the Chicago Metro area.

PGF started with the focus on girls fastpitch and nothing else. They give the teams what they want with tournaments and the way things are run. They changed format for the Regionals in the midwest this year and there have been complaints about. I'm sure those will be addressed and corrected.

In Florida PGF has destroyed ASA/USA in what is basically a year. It is what happens when you take things for granted.

Basically when faced with real competition for the best teams in our area,. ASA/USA hasn't reacted or has done a poor job of it and have been totally run over by better run tournaments, at better locations, with better umpires and better... well everything. They are giving the best teams what they want - and they did it by ASKING THE TEAMS what they want and then providing those things where possible, After EVERY event they ask what went well and what they need to improve on - and they act on it. 90min games + finish the inning, drag and live the fields every game, repair the pitchers circle and batting box every game, city locations or best facilities, better trophies and prizes, better concessions/merch... they have delivered.

They have also become a one-stop shop for the best teams - showcases, multi-college camps as well. So not just qualifiers, but everything the best teams want. Every showcase and camp PGF holds has a wide cross section of Florida and nearby state College Coaches. And then these coaches started turning up at the regular competitive events they run as well. Makes it a REAL easy decision on where to take your team.

Nothing against the teams from Florida that are at ASA/USA Nationals, but they are the second level and third level A teams in the region. When ASA tried to hold qualifiers at some field no one wanted to be at, all the best teams were off at a PGF tournaments. Just 4 years ago a ASA Qualifier would attract 30+ teams per age division... now they are lucky to get 8. There are PGF events in Florida that are scheduled for October and November that are already full.

3 years ago our 'A' teams all played ASA/USA. Now NONE of our teams have any ASA/USA scheduled events. It is every PGF they can get into (plus BackwardsK in Jacksonville) and the occasion USSSA local event because people dont want to travel EVERY weekend

playball4 said:

So my oldest DD played and made
It to OK City for 18 Gold Nationals 7 years ago, and PGF was still new then, but picking up steam. Now youngest DD team’s coach has been trying for PGF for the last couple of years, and they finally made it this year, so we are playing now in SoCal. Out of curiosity I looked up 18G and 16G USA and was shocked to see how few teams are penciled in.
What happened there? 360 teams in PGF 18s and 16s combined, but less than 80 for USA 18G and 16G combined? What did I miss?

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In addition to beaches and beautiful weather, you’re also pretty much guaranteed to not ever be rained out in SoCal at the end of July. Pretty big factor when traveling long distance with weeklong accommodations.

In addition to not being able to rule out rain in OKC in July, you can count on miserable heat (95+ degrees) if it’s not raining.

Not picking on OKC. I’m from the area, but like a lot of places outside of SoCal in July, it’s freaking hot.

Eric F said:

Where's your area?

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Illinois (depending on your definition, Central or Southern or Western ... not Chicago no matter how you look at it though )

Sparky Guy said:

And therein lies the problem with USA softball. The still feel they are relevant in the world of girls fastpitch softball. It's the same thing with the leadership in the Chicago Metro area.

PGF started with the focus on girls fastpitch and nothing else.

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... and that is one of my biggest knocks on both USA Softball and USSSA. If USA Softball wants to be “softball for all” they need to realize that youth softball needs to be run by people focusing on youth softball while adult fastpitch needs to have its own people and focus and adult slowpitch needs its own people and focus.

I honestly can’t say much about USSSA (other than I was woefully unimpressed with their new officials process). I know they try to run baseball, softball, basketball, and some other things all under one umbrella.

I would rather have an organization that focuses.

marriard said:

Basically when faced with real competition for the best teams in our area,. ASA/USA hasn't reacted or has done a poor job of it and have been totally run over by better run tournaments

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I believe it.

marriard said:

at better locations,

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Yep

marriard said:

tournaments with better umpires

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HEY NOW!!!!!!

marriard said:

and better... well everything.

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OK, fine.

Something to keep in mind though ... how much that is the sanctioning body and how much of that is the local folks? For example, my main complex has been all USA for a long time. This year they slipped a handful of USSSA tournaments in. Problem is, it is the same local people running it (the complex and the tournament) just as bad no matter what sanctioning body they have that weekend.