Uppercut Swing

Welcome to Discuss Fastpitch

Your FREE Account is waiting to the Best Softball Community on the Web.

May 12, 2008
2,214
0
Thank you both (Mark and Tom). I'm not ignoring your posts - I'm trying to digest them. A lot of info for me to ... ponder.. and go out and try with my own bat. Mark, I understand the disconnection reasoning in #18 now - thx. Still not sure I understand the diff in 14 & 19 - and I don't see how timing is an issue. I could see it being that #19loses the V, or I could see it being that Ortiz is doing it only for an inside pitch while #19 does it as a normal basis for a swing - I just haven't grasped the timing as the reason for one being a good swing vs the other being a bad swing. Ah, unless by 'timing' you mean the pitch selection - not when the hands come through or something like that, but Oritiz's timing to do it was on the inside pitch and the other guy does it all the time? Thank you again.

A push of the hands forward disconnects the hands and bat from the rotating torso. It then becomes an arm swing.
 
Jan 14, 2009
1,591
0
Atlanta, Georgia
Just a reminder that clip #19 is an over emphasis drill and in my experience teaching my daughter it does not create problems as the narrative below the video says.

It's actual a very effective drill in teaching the hitter to maintain the box and prevent casting. The drill pattern can be adjusted depending on the distance between the hitter and the fence.

I'm sure anyone who has tried to teach the ML swing pattern can appreciate the difficulty in getting a hitter to keep their hands close to their body leading into contact. The tendency is for the hitter to extend their arms too soon.
 
May 12, 2008
2,214
0
Just a reminder that clip #19 is an over emphasis drill and in my experience teaching my daughter it does not create problems as the narrative below the video says.

Glad to hear she doesn't have a problem after this drill. Good athletes seem to overcome much and be careful of conclusions drawn from a sample of one. The majority of youth hitters I see do have disconnection problems and many of those are push disconnect problems. I don't think the fence drill is the reason but neither do I think a drill likely to encourage disconnecting the hands from the rotating torso is a good idea either.

It's actual a very effective drill in teaching the hitter to maintain the box

I don't find this to be my experience. IME they tend to cheat by pushing the hands forward and I don't see how it encourages maintaining the box.

and prevent casting.

It will do that but like many drills it encourages the opposite problem IME.

The drill pattern can be adjusted depending on the distance between the hitter and the fence.

Too many different ways to teach a good swing without using this drill IMO.

I'm sure anyone who has tried to teach the ML swing pattern can appreciate the difficulty in getting a hitter to keep their hands close to their body leading into contact. The tendency is for the hitter to extend their arms too soon.

The ones I see extend their arms too soon are the bat draggers of which there are certainly many. For instance 21-24 Analysis
 
Jan 14, 2009
1,591
0
Atlanta, Georgia
If anyone is interested in finding out more about the merrits of the "Enforcer Drill" just go to Epsteins website, go to the message boards, type in "Enforcer Drill" in the search box, and read up on it. Make sure you go to the
2nd page and click on the "Enforcer Drill Issues" thread and check out Jeter hitting off of a tee in spring trainer.

It's always best to do your own research and decide for yourself.
 
May 12, 2008
2,214
0
Yes, it's always good to go to the source as part of your evaluation of the drill. It's also good to compare what it does as you work with multiple kids and compare both of those to video of elite hitters.
 
May 27, 2008
106
0
Indiana
Wellphyt, great advice...
It's always best to do your own research and decide for yourself.

Taking Mark's word for what is correct and what's not is something to consider, but keeping an open mind and deciding for yourself is the only sure way. On Mark's advice to check video of the best, that is also subject to debate, but again, best to decide what you see.

For instance, Mark thinks the ML swing is best described and taught by Englishbey. I strongly disagree, but rather agree with the opinion and teaching consensus at HittingIllustrated.com. Another thing to avoid is letting friendship or worrying about hurt feelings interfere with what you really believe is right.

I would advise the average dads that Mark so worries about getting bad information to take your advice I quoted above.

Mike
 
Jan 14, 2009
1,591
0
Atlanta, Georgia
I'm the type person that welcomes differing viewpoints because I believe the greatest motivator to learn is to have your ideas challenged. I'm also doing my best to keep an open mind and not to become a fan of any one particular hitting guru.

Because I haven't had the benefit of teaching multiple kids, I am forced to somewhat rely on common sense and intuition. My common sense right now tells me that Epstein has been teaching for many years and has instructed thousands of hitters, and it doesn't seem probable that he would be using a drill that causes disconnect issues for hitters.

I'm always on the lookout for better drills to teach this stuff. I've spent some time on Englishbey's site and haven't come across any earth shattering revelations. But I don't have access to the paid part of his boards where the bulk of the information on what he teaches resides.

Slaught has some good stuff as does Mankin.

I've watched tons of video of elite hitters hitting, and what I see are gifted athletes making instinctive on-the-fly adjustments.

Which makes me think that Epstein is on to something when he says that "the perfect swing is the adjustment the hitter makes to the pitch."
 
May 27, 2008
106
0
Indiana
Wellphyt,

I think you have the right attitude about learning more on hitting. It is good to consider various approaches and philosophies. The farther you go on your journey, the more you will learn.

I like a lot of Epstein's material, as well as Mankin, Candrea/Slaught, and Yeager. Coincidentally, each of these guys put emphasis on hand/arm actions in the swing. Although Epstein and Mankin do not talk about the top hand throwing action, they both encourage getting the hands flat quickly in the swing - which, IMO, results from using the hands/arms in an active sense, and not simply hanging onto the bat and turn, turn, turn.

I've watched tons of video of elite hitters hitting, and what I see are gifted athletes making instinctive on-the-fly adjustments.

Definitely. And they make those adjustments not only with changes in tilt/body posture, but also adjustments the hitter makes to the pitch using hands/arms movements. Many of these ML hitters are riding the back leg (loading the rear hip) as they stride or no-stride, creating stretch (Epstein's "wind the rubber band") as the upper torso loads, then immediately release the stretch when they decide to "go". In looking at video of ML hitters, IMO, when they "go" (unless fooled on the pitch) they whip the bat from the loaded position. There is only one optimum way to do that and it is not by pulling the knob of the bat with the lead arm/hand.

I wish the clip of Pujols taking batting practice at a St. Louis facility that was posted on baseball-fever yesterday was still up. Watching him swing, the whip he was creating from the hands back/scap loaded position was amazing.

Mike
 
Jan 14, 2009
1,591
0
Atlanta, Georgia
One of these days I hope to get my hands on Englishbey's material so I can see for myself what he teaches.

In regards to the top hand, when I perform the swing myself the "scooping sand" cue used by Epstein feels right.

Pulling the knob of the bat with the lead arm/hand is not at all what I think ML hitters do. When I try that it makes me want to bypass the "power V"
position. Plus I think it would constrain a hitter's ability to make on-the-fly adjustments.
 

Members online

Forum statistics

Threads
42,830
Messages
679,481
Members
21,445
Latest member
Bmac81802
Top