Snap the wrist, close the hips?

[sluggers]

I guess I misunderstood what ArmWhip was advocating. Was he saying that you shouldn't teach "wrist snaps" generally or was he talking about not teaching the "cock your wrist" motion?

My DD had the arm and wrist fully extended straight up at the top of her circle. At release, her hand flopped everywhere after she released the ball. Her coach (Ed Serdar) emphasized having a "loose wrist", and having the hand be the last part of a whip action by the arm.

She did do lots of wrist spins in practice. Wrist spins seems to me to improve the strength and flexibility of the wrist as well as the ability to control the wrist.

 

[Amy in AZ.]

Here's a site where you can get a lot of answers.

http://forums.delphiforums.com/fpanalysis/start

 

[halskinner]

Steadman-Hawkins report

Sluggers,

Kids are told at an early age that to have a good fastball they need a strong, full wrist snap. Many girls never make it to 14U because their motion/delivery is crippled by attempting to snap the wrist hard. It is debatable how much the classic 'cock your wrist back and snap hard' motion is used in spin pitches. I have yet to see a picture of any successful pitcher, regardless of what pitch she is throwing, with her wrist cocked back as she comes into release.

That is because by the time she reaches the release point, the wrist has done what it does to contribute to spinning the ball and what little it does to contribute to adding ball speed (Only 1% contribution to ball speed from wrist snap, 3% for elbow snap for those that think it is much more).

The Steadman-Hawkins report broke all the motions down as to their contribution to ball speed.

 

[halskinner]

I dont think it's a case of women teaching pitching differently than men teach it.

I think the confusing issue is that women cannot pitch with exactly the same pitching motion as men. This is becasue of the alignment of the hips and shoulders being so drastically different.

Men can get away with pitching with mechanics that do not have them opening up the hips (or at least opening very little). They can pitch like that relatively safely, with a closed motion. It is not recommended but some do just that, hardly open at all.

However, because of the alignment of the hips and shoulders, women MUST open the hips and shoulders to safely pitch. How much they have to, or need to, close after opening, is still a matter of great debate.

 

[Amy in AZ.]

Hal, I have tried to access those Steadman Hawkins reports in the past - but they look like they cost $35.00 a piece. Is that what you have found?

 

[halskinner]

Hal, I have tried to access those Steadman Hawkins reports in the past - but they look like they cost $35.00 a piece. Is that what you have found?

Send me your email address to ceramatech_engineering@yahoo.com

 

[Rick Pauly]

Wrist Snap

I can believe what Hal has posted relative to wrist snap.
I've done a little experimenting relative to what effect on speed does taking the wrist snap out of the pitch have.

It's pretty simple to do;
1. Measure a pitchers top speed.
2. Now place a bowling glove on her pitching hand (note that a bowling glove has an aluminum brace that doesn't allow the wrist to snap).
3. Now measure the pitchers top speed with the bowling glove on. It will take a few pitches to get used to the glove, but what you will find is that the pitcher can still hit within 1-2 MPH of her previous top speed. I have had several girls that can match their previous top speed.

I'd put more emphasis on the finger action for lots of reasons; speed, accuracy, and spin rate.

 

[Rick Pauly]

Relative to the male vs. female teaching style or pitching style;
I've just spent the past two days reviewing and loading video from last weekend at the Washington Glory vs. Venezuela games.
Wow! What a disparity of styles and mechanics-----especially when comparing the tall pitchers (Pauly/Serrano/Ferguson vs. Mowatt). Short vs. tall pitchers definitely tend to recruit different muscles/mechanics to generate their energy and make the ball move.
I am not certain there is a right or wrong. What I do see is that all are very similar from 12 o'clock to release point. Prior to and after the variation is significant.
This is one reason why in my instruction I have the pitchers throw a lot from the "K"/12 o'clock position.
Here is an interesting fact (sorry for those who have heard me state this many times before)-----a pitcher with good arm whip can throw 90% of her top speed from the 12 o'clock postion. All the other premotions and follow through stuff we teach only adds 10% to speed.
Rick

 

[ArmWhip]

Here we have a pitching coach modeling exactly the kind of wrist snap that you will never actually see on video. Many coaches believe that this is how the wrist moves when pitching and this is dead wrong.

YouTube - ThrowMAX

 

[ifubuildit]

Armwhip

Are you talking about the wrist or the elbow? I might use that wrist snap to throw a peel drop but I wouldnt advise anyone to snap that elbow up in like she displays in this clip.

Unless of course you enjoy medical bills and balls that always go high.

Elliott.