10u pitching to team that crowds the plate

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JAD

Feb 20, 2012
8,231
38
Georgia
A pitcher needs to be able to command both side of the plate. It is very difficult for a pitcher to be effective if they allow batters to take away half of the plate. It is a valuable lesson that HBP are going to happen and pitchers cannot get rattled when they do. The pitchers coaches also need to get into the umpires ear and make sure they are watching for batters leaning into pitches. Anything over the plate or in the river should NOT be a HBP, but a strike or ball on the batter.
 

SB45

Dad, Coach, Chauffeur
Sep 2, 2016
150
28
Western NY
A pitcher needs to be able to command both side of the plate. It is very difficult for a pitcher to be effective if they allow batters to take away half of the plate. It is a valuable lesson that HBP are going to happen and pitchers cannot get rattled when they do. The pitchers coaches also need to get into the umpires ear and make sure they are watching for batters leaning into pitches. Anything over the plate or in the river should NOT be a HBP, but a strike or ball on the batter.

no argument on the main point of this message...a question though. When would a batter hit by a pitch be a ball? In my mind a batter hit by a pitch is either a HBP...or a strike if it is in the strike zone.
 
May 24, 2013
12,461
113
So Cal
no argument on the main point of this message...a question though. When would a batter hit by a pitch be a ball? In my mind a batter hit by a pitch is either a HBP...or a strike if it is in the strike zone.

The only scenario I can think of is if the batter deliberately (in the ump's judgement) moved into the path of a pitch outside the strike zone.
 
Aug 23, 2016
359
43
no argument on the main point of this message...a question though. When would a batter hit by a pitch be a ball? In my mind a batter hit by a pitch is either a HBP...or a strike if it is in the strike zone.

I think he's saying that if the pitch is in the river (the space between the plate and the inside edge of the batter's box) and the batter gets hit while hanging out in that area, the call should be a ball and not HBP.
 

JAD

Feb 20, 2012
8,231
38
Georgia
no argument on the main point of this message...a question though. When would a batter hit by a pitch be a ball? In my mind a batter hit by a pitch is either a HBP...or a strike if it is in the strike zone.

A ball in the river is not really a strike, but I bet most umpires would call it a HBP...
 
Jun 22, 2008
3,731
113
A ball in the river is not really a strike, but I bet most umpires would call it a HBP...

Most umpires should not be calling it a hit by pitch if the batter made no attempt to avoid being hit by a ball in the river. Contrary to popular belief including a large number of umpires even the rule sets that have supposedly eliminated the requirement to avoid being hit by the pitch are still required to make an attempt to avoid the ball unless the entire ball is inside the batters box. That would require the entire ball to be more than 6" off the edge of the plate. It really didnt take a rocket scientist to figure out the HBP rate was going to increase dramatically when they changed the rule. NCAA baseball tried it and ultimately went back to requiring the batter to avoid. NCAA softball had the exact same problem with batters hanging over the edge of the plate and being awarded 1st. Rather than just go back to the old rule they decided they needed to better educate the officials on how the rule was suppose to be called. Worked a little, but still have batters hanging over the edge of the plate like statues.

USA still requires the batter to attempt to avoid the ball no matter where the pitch is.
 

JAD

Feb 20, 2012
8,231
38
Georgia
Most umpires should not be calling it a hit by pitch if the batter made no attempt to avoid being hit by a ball in the river. Contrary to popular belief including a large number of umpires even the rule sets that have supposedly eliminated the requirement to avoid being hit by the pitch are still required to make an attempt to avoid the ball unless the entire ball is inside the batters box. That would require the entire ball to be more than 6" off the edge of the plate. It really didnt take a rocket scientist to figure out the HBP rate was going to increase dramatically when they changed the rule. NCAA baseball tried it and ultimately went back to requiring the batter to avoid. NCAA softball had the exact same problem with batters hanging over the edge of the plate and being awarded 1st. Rather than just go back to the old rule they decided they needed to better educate the officials on how the rule was suppose to be called. Worked a little, but still have batters hanging over the edge of the plate like statues.

USA still requires the batter to attempt to avoid the ball no matter where the pitch is.

Especially with the development of Evo Shield elbow guards!
 
Aug 23, 2016
359
43
Especially with the development of Evo Shield elbow guards!

At a tournament this summer DD's team faced a team (8U) where several girls wore elbow guards. It was ridiculous. I wanted to ask the coach if maybe the girls wouldn't need the guards if they didn't hang over the plate and lean into pitches, but I didn't think anything productive would come from that conversation.
 
May 24, 2013
12,461
113
So Cal
In semi-related news...

This was from a recent tournament. Last 2 were consecutive ABs with the same pitcher.


My DD has a track record of HBPs. Jan-Aug of this year, she got hit 17 times (next most on her team was 6). She's not a plate-crowder, just a ball magnet.
 

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